|
Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Jun 17, 2021 13:32:14 GMT -7
I've got a great LP Special with P90s and I haven't played it since the virus hit and we stopped gigging. I usually play humbuckers here at home because I hate the hum...but man do I love the tone!
So P90 players, how do you like setting yours up? With humbuckers I've lately been backing off the strings and getting rewarded with a more open, sweet tone. The P90 spec from Gibson is 3/64", fretted at the 22nd fret. I've been playing around with mine this afternoon and I found that my neck pickup was quite a bit louder than my bridge, so I've backed it way off. Right now I'm at 3/64" on the bridge and nearly 6/64 on the neck. They sound good there, and the neck is a little bit quieter than the bridge, which I like.
How say you? Do you set P90s up closer or further from the strings than you would a humbucker?
|
|
|
Post by Russell B on Jun 17, 2021 15:10:36 GMT -7
I’ll measure my Gold Top tonight! I think P90s are making a comeback!
|
|
|
Post by RickJames on Jun 17, 2021 16:10:37 GMT -7
P90’s generally have about the same output as std humbucker, however significantly less magnetic pull on the strings.
|
|
|
Post by Seńor Verde on Jun 17, 2021 16:32:00 GMT -7
I wish I knew then what I know about setups when I had my ES-330. It had dog ear P-90's so the overall height was not adjustable. That guitar sounded incredible and my non-guitar playing brother still says it was a great sounding guitar. I'm pretty sure the distance between the strings and pickups was considerably more than the spec you give. The other guitar player in my current band has a Les Paul from the early 50's and when I did some work on it for him, found it sounded better with the pickups lower than factory spec. As they say, let your ears be the judge.
|
|
|
Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Jun 17, 2021 17:36:46 GMT -7
Yep, I've got an Epi Casino with dog ears, and they're fairly low too.
|
|
jmb
New Member
Posts: 41
Member is Online
|
Post by jmb on Jun 18, 2021 14:39:41 GMT -7
In terms of the level of hum, are you better off with a single P90? Never owned a P90 guitar but have always wanted one.
|
|
|
Post by Don A on Jun 18, 2021 15:33:57 GMT -7
P90’s generally have about the same output as std humbucker, however significantly less magnetic pull on the strings. Is it less magnetic pull? They have half the poles, but twice the magnet.
|
|
|
Post by Don A on Jun 18, 2021 15:36:35 GMT -7
In terms of the level of hum, are you better off with a single P90? Never owned a P90 guitar but have always wanted one. It doesn't really matter, though if you have two P90s, one can be wound reverse with reverse magnetic polarity compared to the other and cancel hum when they're both selected. I don't really like that because the hum comes right back when you change the volume of a single pickup when both are combined or when you switch to a single pickup.
|
|
|
Post by Don A on Jun 18, 2021 15:38:50 GMT -7
To answer the OP's question, I like my P90s pretty close to the strings- I like it when they sound punchy and raw! Notice the risers under the dogear P90s on my ES-225. You can't see it, but there's also a shim under the bridge pickup.
|
|
|
Post by RickJames on Jun 18, 2021 17:44:53 GMT -7
P90’s generally have about the same output as std humbucker, however significantly less magnetic pull on the strings. Is it less magnetic pull? They have half the poles, but twice the magnet. Yes, significant ly less
|
|
|
Post by pcns on Jun 18, 2021 20:24:39 GMT -7
I've been winding my neck pickup with less windings than the bridge so they are a little quieter so you move them around however you like. Also a little brighter that way.
Next time I come up Dave I'll bring up a set and we can measure the inductance vs a humbucker. Some P90's are wound with an Alnico 3 magnet that is much weaker than the A5 or A2 magnets in a humbucker but the P90 uses 2 magnets where PAF type humbuckers usr only one magnet shared between the 2 bobbins. It will be interesting to see how the inductance measures.
|
|
|
Post by RickJames on Jun 19, 2021 8:10:21 GMT -7
To answer the OP's question, I like my P90s pretty close to the strings- I like it when they sound punchy and raw! Notice the risers under the dogear P90s on my ES-225. You can't see it, but there's also a shim under the bridge pickup.
|
|
|
Post by RickJames on Jun 19, 2021 8:11:28 GMT -7
Beautiful guitar! I think me likes even better than a 295 !
|
|
|
Post by nicholas on Jun 19, 2021 8:33:37 GMT -7
I put them as close to the strings as possible. Same with humbuckers. For dog ears I use the shims like Don A mentioned, Lollar sells them.
I like how they respond to volume roll off when they are closer to the strings. Rolling off a little volume sounds very similar to having them further away to me.
|
|
|
Post by Joey Beverages on Jun 28, 2021 6:57:50 GMT -7
Bridge pickup pretty high and close to the strings
Neck pickup lowered down.
Frank shared this with me a while back when I was trying to figure out my P90 LP Special with the wrap around bridge
Took a few twists and turns to find the right heights ….. but when ya get ‘em dialled in it is plenty of fun!
Not sure if I answered the OP …. but just my .02
Cheers always
Joel
|
|
|
Post by GuitarZ on Jun 30, 2021 12:44:11 GMT -7
Sorry for being late. I wanted to chime in since the gent that does my annual/semi-annual guitar setups adjusted mine. I figure (actually I know), he knows more than me. If I fret my Gold Top Les Paul at the 22nd fret, my neck pickup is kind of between 3/64th's and 4/64's. The bridge is at about 1/8th (8/64th's) from the strings. Unfretted, the neck pickup is 1/8th inch away. I'm very happy with the sound, tone, and balance.
|
|
|
Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Jun 30, 2021 13:12:45 GMT -7
That sounds like it would be really bass heavy, wouldn't it?
|
|
|
Post by GuitarZ on Jul 1, 2021 8:58:54 GMT -7
That sounds like it would be really bass heavy, wouldn't it? Hmmm. First, I take back that the guitar tech adjusted the pickups. He definitely adjusted my Strat, but I'm not sure about my Les Paul. So, if he didn't, then that means that I probably adjusted them back in the late 70's. And, I would have had limited resources to go by since there was only Guitar Player Magazine and my older brother who knew a little. I can imagine the teenage me thinking "I need to get more output to overdrive my amp" and setting the pickup close to the strings. So, I was going to respond "No. It's not bass heavy at all." But, the fact that I've been playing the guitar like this for 45 years, I've obviously adjusted to it. And, now that you mention it, I have to work the Ghia tone control to get away from what our other guitar/keyboard player characterized as "a little hairy on the low end". And, my settings on my Maz Jr has the bass very low at 7:30. I did a little research this morning on P90 pickup height. It was interesting in that they said a lot of what's said above. But, for the most part, the articles also said "Set it where you like it" vs saying "Set it here". So, you have me thinking. But, I'm guessing I won't change the height. I play rhythm in the middle position with the neck/bridge volumes set equally (typically around 6-7) and then jump to the neck pickup for leads at 10 or sometimes play leads in the middle. Bottom line is: Don't go by my settings. If you want to hear it, the lead guitar on the tune below is my Les Paul and Ghia. It is a full sound with full bottom although I attribute a lot of it to the speaker/mic combo I was using in my Ox. At least I now learned how to add a Spotify player.
|
|
|
Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Jul 1, 2021 17:12:37 GMT -7
I totally agree, set it like you like it. It's interesting to see what all you are doing with yours and experimentation is always good. For me it's a never ending journey and I love it. Thanks!
|
|
|
Post by zpilot on Jul 4, 2021 0:23:26 GMT -7
For rock tones (think Leslie West) I always set the bridge P-90 fairly close to the strings. That is how my 1954 Gold Top was when I got it. That is my gold standard and how I have set them since. Of course that could have been adjusted who knows how many times before I got that guitar in 1973. For jazz oriented players I set them a little lower and that is usually on hollow-body arch top guitars.
|
|
|
Post by nicholas on Jul 4, 2021 3:42:58 GMT -7
Oh, also when setting pickup height on P90's or humbuckers I use a my db meter with a clean amp sound. I usually set the bridge first to my liking, then match the neck in volume with the db meter. Once the volumes of the pickups match I'm usually good to go. I'm mostly on the bridge so I'll favor getting that one right and make any compromises on the neck pickup height.
I've found the db meter helpful. Sometimes it's hard to accurately judge the volume difference between the pickups because the tone changes so much between them. When I started using the meter to match them I noticed a more seamless switch between the pickups when actually playing.
|
|
|
Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Jul 4, 2021 5:28:18 GMT -7
Oh, also when setting pickup height on P90's or humbuckers I use a my db meter with a clean amp sound. I usually set the bridge first to my liking, then match the neck in volume with the db meter. Once the volumes of the pickups match I'm usually good to go. I'm mostly on the bridge so I'll favor getting that one right and make any compromises on the neck pickup height. I've found the db meter helpful. Sometimes it's hard to accurately judge the volume difference between the pickups because the tone changes so much between them. When I started using the meter to match them I noticed a more seamless switch between the pickups when actually playing. Sometimes I'll hook up an AC Millivoltmeter up to the guitar and measure the actual voltage output of the pickups and balance them like that. Usually I like the neck to be just a bit softer than the bridge so when I mix them it gives me a blend of tones between either pickup alone. Good stuff here, fellas. Thanks. Keep those cards and letters comin'!
|
|
|
Post by GuitarZ on Jul 4, 2021 10:11:38 GMT -7
I've got to give the db meter a try to see how my pickups are balanced especially since my setup appears to be the opposite of what most of you are doing. Actually, I'll just record it into my PC software to look at the waveforms and levels. Nice idea! I forgot to add one thing. My neck tone control broke back in the late 70's/early 80's. My brother bypassed it so I could play a gig. It took a while to get a replacement since we didn't have the internet to order things from with overnight deliveries. When we put the new tone control in, I noticed that I lost some brightness on the neck pickup. I apparently had gotten used to that sound to the point where we simply redid the tone control bypass on the neck pickup. (Also, I really don't touch my guitar tone controls.) That might be part of what balances out what would be a heavier bass sound.
|
|
|
Post by zpilot on Jul 5, 2021 4:33:29 GMT -7
On most of my guitars I have bypassed the tone control for the neck pickup. Especially if it has a single tone control for both pickups. Mostly it was to eliminate having to retweak that control when switching pickups. I almost always had the tone control on full treble with the neck pickup anyway.
|
|
|
Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Jul 5, 2021 5:30:16 GMT -7
I've got to give the db meter a try to see how my pickups are balanced especially since my setup appears to be the opposite of what most of you are doing. Actually, I'll just record it into my PC software to look at the waveforms and levels. Nice idea! I forgot to add one thing. My neck tone control broke back in the late 70's/early 80's. My brother bypassed it so I could play a gig. It took a while to get a replacement since we didn't have the internet to order things from with overnight deliveries. When we put the new tone control in, I noticed that I lost some brightness on the neck pickup. I apparently had gotten used to that sound to the point where we simply redid the tone control bypass on the neck pickup. (Also, I really don't touch my guitar tone controls.) That might be part of what balances out what would be a heavier bass sound. One suggestion, write down the current positions so you can always get back to the way it is now.
|
|
|
Post by pcns on Jul 5, 2021 20:18:38 GMT -7
I totally agree, set it like you like it. It's interesting to see what all you are doing with yours and experimentation is always good. For me it's a never ending journey and I love it. Thanks! it's interesting to experiment, if you haven't made any changes in a while a pickup height adjustment can really freshen up your tone
|
|
|
Post by RickJames on Jul 6, 2021 12:20:31 GMT -7
On most of my guitars I have bypassed the tone control for the neck pickup. Especially if it has a single tone control for both pickups. Mostly it was to eliminate having to retweak that control when switching pickups. I almost always had the tone control on full treble with the neck pickup anyway. I like that idea. May try it on one of my guitars. Even playing a straight head jazz gig, the tone on your amp is the best way to go, and keep the neck pu full on treble. I think you get the most out of your ax , tone wise . IMO
|
|
|
Post by John E. on Jul 15, 2021 11:02:15 GMT -7
I've never actually gotten along with P90's. I built a partscaster, its a tele with a mahogany body, maple neck, and P90's. That is by far the muddiest guitar I've ever played, I just can never get a useable tone from it.
|
|
|
Post by RickJames on Jul 15, 2021 11:49:58 GMT -7
I've never actually gotten along with P90's. I built a partscaster, its a tele with a mahogany body, maple neck, and P90's. That is by far the muddiest guitar I've ever played, I just can never get a useable tone from it. Did you keep the guitar? Did you try any other pots ?
|
|
|
Post by John E. on Jul 20, 2021 12:26:10 GMT -7
I've never actually gotten along with P90's. I built a partscaster, its a tele with a mahogany body, maple neck, and P90's. That is by far the muddiest guitar I've ever played, I just can never get a useable tone from it. Did you keep the guitar? Did you try any other pots ? I definitely still have the guitar! It's too sentimental for me to ever part with. I've tried different pots before, I even had a treble bleed circuit installed, nothing helps for some reason. It's just that I can never get it to be very versatile. In the past when I've played guitars with P90's I've always loved how dynamic they are, and how nicely they clean up using the guitar volume. This guitar just doesn't wanna do any of that LOL! I can dial in a good bridge pickup tone, but then the neck is muddy, and when i roll back the volume it just loses all character. So I just keep it in a display in my living room with some other memorabilia!
|
|