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Post by Don A on May 20, 2021 9:51:41 GMT -7
I know it's not up to the power rating, but has anyone tried a Greenback in their Nova 1x12 combo?
I just ran my Nova through my Wreck Jr combo's cab, and I don't know if it was the Greenback, the voicing of the Wreck Jr's cab, or both, but it sounded glorious!!! I could've played all day. The clean channel was grittier, and the dirty channel was dirtier yet less "fizzy". I could've played Social Distortion songs all afternoon- with a Telecaster! Both channels were more touch sensitive and less "strident" (not that the Nova is a strident amp). There was also less of a jump in volume between channels, though that was at home, and the jump may be required with a band.
I have a 65 watt Scumback M75-PVC that I can try in the Nova (I actually preferred the Greenback over the M75-PVC in the Wreck Jr).
My initial goal was to try the Wreck Jr through the Nova's G12H30. It sounded fine, but it didn't change the character of the amp like the Greenback did in the Nova.
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Post by LT on May 20, 2021 18:24:39 GMT -7
Isn't the Creamback supposed to be a higher power Greenback? Maybe that would fit the bill (?) There's also the Neo-dymium CB that would save some weight (if that's an issue).
I haven't tried my Nova with a Celestion. I have an Emi Lil Texas Neo in mine and really like it, but it leans more toward the American side of things.
I'm interested in hearing where you land on this. Let us know!
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Post by Don A on May 25, 2021 15:18:17 GMT -7
Thanks for the suggestion. Even Celestion admits that the 65 watt Creamback sounds a little different than the Greenback. I'm afraid that some of the impolite nastiness that the Greenback added to the Nova would be tamed, there is a used one for sale locally, though.
Last night, just for kicks, I tried the Nova through the Weber 12A125 in my tweed Deluxe clone. Though it was a tad bright, I might've liked it better than the Greenback!
Besides the Scumback M-75 PVC, I have a few Scumback alnicos I can try as well. Maybe I'll even try the Z-12 from my Cure!
BTW, it's not that I don't like the amp with the speaker that's in it- I do, it can just be a little better for me.
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Post by adam on May 25, 2021 15:53:13 GMT -7
BTW, it's not that I don't like the amp with the speaker that's in it- I do, it can just be a little better for me. Nothing wrong with that. Yesterday I plugged something in and it was "not quite what I was looking for". Then I played for a while and kind of learned how to play that sound and make it sound good. What really struck me was how "bad" it sounded if I picked with the pick parallel to the strings, and how good it sounded by picking lightly with the pick on a pretty big angle to the strings. That little change was really night and day and maybe in part how one person can play the same gear and it sounds completely different. Basically I'm agreeing with you, everyone is different. It's kind of like the amp is an instrument no different than a guitar.
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Post by ME on May 25, 2021 16:36:32 GMT -7
BTW, it's not that I don't like the amp with the speaker that's in it- I do, it can just be a little better for me. Nothing wrong with that. Yesterday I plugged something in and it was "not quite what I was looking for". Then I played for a while and kind of learned how to play that sound and make it sound good. What really struck me was how "bad" it sounded if I picked with the pick parallel to the strings, and how good it sounded by picking lightly with the pick on a pretty big angle to the strings. That little change was really night and day and maybe in part how one person can play the same gear and it sounds completely different. Basically I'm agreeing with you, everyone is different. It's kind of like the amp is an instrument no different than a guitar. More on the pick thing… I use many different picks. Soft, hard, really thin, thin, and medium. I don’t like really thick, stiff picks (I was given an agate (stone) which is interesting) or a metal pick (thin stainless) I have. I find each has a different tone/feel which changes the way I play and the songs I choose to play. Some might wonder if it makes a difference in a band situation… I believe it can. ME
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Post by adam on May 25, 2021 17:36:12 GMT -7
More on the pick thing… I use many different picks. Soft, hard, really thin, thin, and medium. I don’t like really thick, stiff picks (I was given an agate (stone) which is interesting) or a metal pick (thin stainless) I have. I find each has a different tone/feel which changes the way I play and the songs I choose to play. Some might wonder if it makes a difference in a band situation… I believe it can. ME It's a MASSIVE difference. Couple thoughts/observations: I saw a thing with Josh from JHS do this thing where he played a few different picks, some fancy stone one, then picked up the box something came in and used that, they all sounded the same. I'm thinking what a moron, but I know he's brilliant and was just doing it for fun, but it couldn't be farther from the truth. For me, I played Fender heavy for a long time, sometimes extra heavy. But, I always thought fender mediums sounded better and I played those a lot too, but harder to play fast. As I got older, I could care less about that stuff now. Side note, say the Tortex picks of the same gauge and shape, I can't stand how those sound. Cut to the chase, I was trying to play 10's on Gibson scale tuned 1/2 step down and in drop D. That just didn't work at all with that thing where you hit the low E and it goes sharp about 1/4 step on attack. I didn't feel like changing strings (that sucks), so I tried a dunlop nylon .60 which feels just like a fender thin. It worked! I could play chords without them being all out of tune. You can tremolo pick just as fast as say a heavy, but coordination between hands is really hard. So think VH1 with 9-40's tuned down 1/2 step (or more), the thin pick, and related, small frets. It works. Thin pick - you get a lot less low end, and you don't pull the strings way sharp when you hit them. Much softer attack too. Anyway, once I got used to that sound, every time I heard someone playing a heavier pick, I could hear it in a second and I think it sounds like crap. What I find now is if I go from the thin to the medium, the medium now feels like an extra heavy with no give at all. It never used to feel like that. I also find they have about twice the attack and a ton more low end. That can be a good thing, so I have no preference, I'm just saying the difference is massive. Take that VH1 sound, he has no low end, and I'm sure that amp in general was putting out a ton of low end. It's not just the bright JBL's or eq or whatever, it was the sound coming from him and his instrument. back to the mediums with 10's at standard tuning, I find I have to be really careful with how hard I hold the pick as to not make say the low E go sharp on a chord. I kind of find I hold my hand kind of clenched fist with the light pick, and loose and open with medium. Even more loose if I try a heavy, but that's really a battle to play the guitar in tune. Lastly, I had a friend over once and I was playing what I thought was a gorgeous clean tone in a Marshall type amp with a 65 Strat. Gave him the guitar and I was completely dumb founded how horrible it sounded. So I gave him a bunch of ****, but it kind of pissed me off too. Anyway, he uses those fender heavy small jazz picks and it just sounded like he was playing the guitar with brick, just horrible. In his element he kind of sounds like a mix of Lukather and Lunch and has had a bunch of endorsements, so it's not he can't play. It's just that he can only play in that blow your head off impress mode. Anyway, not just the pick, but how you attack it is everything. Boy that was long... I guess I encourage people to experiment.
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Post by premiumplus (Dave) on May 25, 2021 17:56:49 GMT -7
I played Fender thins for years with .008 strings. Then went to .009's and Fender mediums. I think I'm going to go back to the thins because like you Adam, I always pull the strings sharp with thicker picks.
Guys like Jeff Beck have the tone only great fingers can give, I wish wish wish there was a pick that sounded like that. Ah well, like you say, experiment. I've tried coins too but that really didn't work for me. I don't see how guys like Brian May or Rev Billy G could do it. Does Gibbons still use a peso, or was that one of his myths?
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Post by Don A on May 25, 2021 18:27:41 GMT -7
This has gone a bit off topic, but it's another topic that interests me. I've used Fender Extra heavy 358 picks on electrics (with .009" strings) and heavy 358 picks on acoustics (.012" strings) for years. I loved the warmer tone from the extra heavy picks and the snap from the lighter heavy pick.
I recently went to order more extra heavy 358s and found out they are no longer available! They're not available from D'Andrea, either. So I bought D'Andrea Pro Plec 358s which are even thicker and warmer- too warm on many guitar. To the point of sounding dull.
This lead me to trying heavy 358s on my electric guitars and I might prefer them over extra heavy 358s.
My touch is pretty light and I don't pull my guitar out of tune with a heavy pick.
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Post by ME on May 25, 2021 18:44:11 GMT -7
This has gone a bit off topic, but it's another topic that interests me. I've used Fender Extra heavy 358 picks on electrics (with .009" strings) and heavy 358 picks on acoustics (.012" strings) for years. I loved the warmer tone from the extra heavy picks and the snap from the lighter heavy pick. I recently went to order more extra heavy 358s and found out they are no longer available! They're not available from D'Andrea, either. So I bought D'Andrea Pro Plec 358s which are even thicker and warmer- too warm on many guitar. To the point of sounding dull. This lead me to trying heavy 358s on my electric guitars and I might prefer them over extra heavy 358s. My touch is pretty light and I don't pull my guitar out of tune with a heavy pick. Sorry, my bad for the hijack, just had to comment on the pick thing. I have nothing on the speaker/Nova thing. Carry on! ME
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Post by adam on May 25, 2021 18:53:42 GMT -7
I played Fender thins for years with .008 strings. Then went to .009's and Fender mediums. I think I'm going to go back to the thins because like you Adam, I always pull the strings sharp with thicker picks. Guys like Jeff Beck have the tone only great fingers can give, I wish wish wish there was a pick that sounded like that. Ah well, like you say, experiment. I've tried coins too but that really didn't work for me. I don't see how guys like Brian May or Rev Billy G could do it. Does Gibbons still use a peso, or was that one of his myths? For the tuning problem thing, try tuning to the attack. For instance if you use a tuner and let the string settle, it's going to be sharp when you hit it. You can try repeatedly attacking the string and watching the tuner and get it in tune with the attack. Usually you are just playing so hearing the attack anyway, and if you sustain something, you can always wiggle your hands around making a sharp vibrato which masks that. Look at say Lukather, he doesn't just hit a chord and his left hand is stagnant. Maybe also note AC/DC's Dirty Deeds, he hits say the low E chord and it's in tune, then then low E falls flat. Somehow, that creates a really sinister sound which is much more pleasing than the note being sharp at attack. For me, I kind of temper around the 3rd fret low E to the 5th fret D string. Those have to sound right on attack, then I can kind of live with maybe the low E is a little flat. Third fret low E not matching open G string on an open G chord drives me batty too, but generally that comes together with the previous thing. I might also say if the high E string feels flat to 2nd fret D string, that drives me crazy too. So I try to tune the high E to that note making sure I'm not pushing to hard on the D string. Then tune the open B to the high E and get that right. Then check octave open D to 3rd fret B string. Then F around with open D to open G and open D to 2nd fret G and try to find something that works there. The whole thing is sort of a compromise, like perfect 4ths and 5ths don't even sound right when they are in "tune". They are off a few cents or something. Worst is the major 3rd. Like try tuning the open B to the open G. Bring the B way down and bring it up until it sounds like a car horn. That's in tune. The check 3rd fret B string against the open G and it's flat as a pancake. Anyway, then try playing running with the devil with that open B in tune with the open G... there's that sound. He did that on a lot of stuff. Having said all that, don't be afraid to adjust the intonation even if the strings are old. That thing about you can only intonate new strings is just stupid. Bonus points, intonate by ear. I think you'd be surprised how you can hear a few cents without a tuner. Beck - he sounds fantastic with a pick too. It's just him, and he continuously adjusts whatever on the guitar and his approach to make it sound right to him. The sounds he wants to make are in his head and the he adapts his hands and controls on the guitar to get that sound. Only one Beck. Maybe not what people notice about him, but his timing is unreal. Same for his perception of pitch. The coin thing - I bet you could make that work if you wanted to. They probably just lightly brush over the string on an angle. Gibbons uses his fingers a lot too.
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Post by premiumplus (Dave) on May 26, 2021 11:02:10 GMT -7
I played Fender thins for years with .008 strings. Then went to .009's and Fender mediums. I think I'm going to go back to the thins because like you Adam, I always pull the strings sharp with thicker picks. Guys like Jeff Beck have the tone only great fingers can give, I wish wish wish there was a pick that sounded like that. Ah well, like you say, experiment. I've tried coins too but that really didn't work for me. I don't see how guys like Brian May or Rev Billy G could do it. Does Gibbons still use a peso, or was that one of his myths? For the tuning problem thing, try tuning to the attack. For instance if you use a tuner and let the string settle, it's going to be sharp when you hit it. You can try repeatedly attacking the string and watching the tuner and get it in tune with the attack. Usually you are just playing so hearing the attack anyway, and if you sustain something, you can always wiggle your hands around making a sharp vibrato which masks that. Look at say Lukather, he doesn't just hit a chord and his left hand is stagnant. Maybe also note AC/DC's Dirty Deeds, he hits say the low E chord and it's in tune, then then low E falls flat. Somehow, that creates a really sinister sound which is much more pleasing than the note being sharp at attack. For me, I kind of temper around the 3rd fret low E to the 5th fret D string. Those have to sound right on attack, then I can kind of live with maybe the low E is a little flat. Third fret low E not matching open G string on an open G chord drives me batty too, but generally that comes together with the previous thing. I might also say if the high E string feels flat to 2nd fret D string, that drives me crazy too. So I try to tune the high E to that note making sure I'm not pushing to hard on the D string. Then tune the open B to the high E and get that right. Then check octave open D to 3rd fret B string. Then F around with open D to open G and open D to 2nd fret G and try to find something that works there. The whole thing is sort of a compromise, like perfect 4ths and 5ths don't even sound right when they are in "tune". They are off a few cents or something. Worst is the major 3rd. Like try tuning the open B to the open G. Bring the B way down and bring it up until it sounds like a car horn. That's in tune. The check 3rd fret B string against the open G and it's flat as a pancake. Anyway, then try playing running with the devil with that open B in tune with the open G... there's that sound. He did that on a lot of stuff. Having said all that, don't be afraid to adjust the intonation even if the strings are old. That thing about you can only intonate new strings is just stupid. Bonus points, intonate by ear. I think you'd be surprised how you can hear a few cents without a tuner. Beck - he sounds fantastic with a pick too. It's just him, and he continuously adjusts whatever on the guitar and his approach to make it sound right to him. The sounds he wants to make are in his head and the he adapts his hands and controls on the guitar to get that sound. Only one Beck. Maybe not what people notice about him, but his timing is unreal. Same for his perception of pitch. The coin thing - I bet you could make that work if you wanted to. They probably just lightly brush over the string on an angle. Gibbons uses his fingers a lot too. Thanks, Adam...I've actually used the 'tune to attack' technique and continue to. Like you say, it's all compromise on the guitar. What drives me batty is that I've got perfect relative pitch. Not perfect pitch per se, my understanding is that someone with perfect pitch can be asked to sing (or tune to) a "C2" pitch and hit it with no reference pitch. I can detect very minute pitch differences, under 1 cent. And the perfect 4th and 5th thing...yeah. Drives me nuts!
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Post by adam on May 27, 2021 16:52:53 GMT -7
I can detect very minute pitch differences, under 1 cent. And the perfect 4th and 5th thing...yeah. Drives me nuts! I bet a lot of people are like that. With guitar, you just have to learn how to make it work somehow. Every time I pick up a LP, it feels out of tune for 5 minutes until I dial in a bit. I have one friend with true perfect pitch. The way he found out was funny, a music theory teacher called on him to name the chord on a piano and he said something like "I don't know, but you playing the notes (whatever)". That lead to the another 1/2 hour of teacher trying to stump him by just laying his arms across the piano and he could name every note in sequence. Lucky enough to play with him for a while and it was a riot because you would play anything and he'd respond with a chord or whatever because he could just hear it and he never had any idea what he was playing. He went on to join Dave Mason's band when he was around 22 (quite a while ago) and toured the world. Since then he's played either keys or guitar in any big band around Chicago. Talked to him a couple days ago, he's pretty much deaf from doing this for a living for 30 years or so. Kind of sad. Never had, or had to have a "real" job. Anyway, that's the difference between perfect pitch and good relative pitch.
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