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Post by dgabbear on Dec 20, 2006 17:51:26 GMT -7
I recently purchased a newer but hardly ever used MAZ Jr 1x12 (2 weeks ago) and this happens to be my very first EL84 based amp. I notice that the power tubes rattle like mad. Is this a very common issue with EL84 based amps and these types of tubes? If I were to buy and install a new duet of EL84's, will they start rattling immediately or is this something that develops over time, such as my 6L6, EL34 amps? I am assuming of course that because it is a combo, the tubes are most likely to develop a rattle.
Next question If rattling is a common problem with these types of tubes, what can one do to minimize rattle? Any help is appreciated and thanks.
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Post by Curt on Dec 20, 2006 18:14:49 GMT -7
Do a search on here for tube dampners, several have had great success with them.
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Post by guitarboy02451 on Dec 20, 2006 20:23:38 GMT -7
dgabbear, Yes, they rattle in a combo amp as well as the rectifier. With my Maz Sr head there is no rattle, but with my Ghia there is rattle. With my friends Ghia there is rattle along with his Kendrick Gold 45. I put these on my EL84's and Rectifier and all the rattle went away. It's short money and you'll love how it resolves your issue. herbiesaudiolab.home.att.net/
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Post by mudskipper on Dec 21, 2006 6:59:45 GMT -7
what makes you think they are rattling?
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Post by Lefty on Dec 21, 2006 9:06:19 GMT -7
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Post by myles on Dec 21, 2006 12:38:17 GMT -7
A good set should not rattle.
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Post by dgabbear on Dec 21, 2006 18:31:50 GMT -7
Just out of curiosity, do these tube dampers really make the bass response tighter sounding on an amp?
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Post by ruger9 on Dec 21, 2006 19:18:20 GMT -7
The EL84's in my Classic 50 are silent- but they are also enclosed in a "padded cage" of sorts, under the chassis.
The EL84's in my C20 DO rattle- did- they are just plugged into the sockets, hanging out in the breeze, very close to & right behind the speaker.
I got the o-ring tube dampers for the C20, used them on the 12AX7's as well, quieted them right up. No increased tightness in bass response or change in tone whatsoever, just takes away the high-pitched rattle of the tubes.
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Post by guitarboy02451 on Dec 21, 2006 20:35:01 GMT -7
A good set should not rattle. I've heard that... but my new Ghia arrived with rattling el84's, so I went to GC and bought a new set, and they rattle as well. My friends 84's in his ghia rattle.
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Post by guitarboy02451 on Dec 21, 2006 20:35:35 GMT -7
Just out of curiosity, do these tube dampers really make the bass response tighter sounding on an amp? No. But they stop the rattle.
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Post by zdogma on Dec 21, 2006 21:03:04 GMT -7
A good set should not rattle. Probably true. I've only had two sets that didn't rattle in my ghia, a set of NOS tungsols and a set of NOS GE's. The GT EL84S are OK, I've had 3 sets, the first set that came in the amp rattled something awful (maybe some shop wear/shipping damage), the next two were fine for about 6 months(60 hours or so), then...rattle. Not too bad, just a bit on the low notes, but kind of irritating. I find it worse if I'm sitting next to the amp. I tried a set of EH's. They started in about 3 hours. Really loud and irritating. The tube rings do help a bit.
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Post by nitehawk55 on Dec 22, 2006 13:21:00 GMT -7
I have a set of Groove Tube's that rattle too and wonder at the extra cost . I think it was guitargeorge who suggested some time ago that automotive type silicone gasket goop ( for hot applications ) worked well if you ran a bead or 2 of it around the tubes . I have not tried it but I think a couple on here chimed in and said it did remove the rattle and was a cheap fix compared to the damper rings
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Post by skydog958 on Dec 22, 2006 19:58:24 GMT -7
I have rattle issues with my 45 combo. It's either the EF86 or the rec. I'm looking into getting tube rings. It's not a problem though if I'm using the Airbrake at 3 or lower, unless I'm using my 535. That guitar hits the amp pretty hard (in a good way, minus the rattle).
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Post by nitehawk55 on Dec 22, 2006 20:14:26 GMT -7
If your H 535 has the punch mine does I can understand that ! Some folks are missing out on a fine guitar that can be had used at a very reasonable price ;D
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Post by guitarboy02451 on Dec 23, 2006 8:12:29 GMT -7
I have a set of Groove Tube's that rattle too and wonder at the extra cost . I think it was guitargeorge who suggested some time ago that automotive type silicone gasket goop ( for hot applications ) worked well if you ran a bead or 2 of it around the tubes . I have not tried it but I think a couple on here chimed in and said it did remove the rattle and was a cheap fix compared to the damper rings Nighthawk, herbiesaudiolab.home.att.net/THese work. All the rattle stoped. Get a set for your EL84's HAHL o 09's for the EL84's and HAL o 27 for the Rectifier. Fixes the problem right away. No need to get automotive gaskets etc... Just get the teflon... really cheap and effective.
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Post by foxx on Dec 23, 2006 10:00:56 GMT -7
I have had some that rattle and some that don't. I orderd them from GT, they rattled right away, sent them back and the new ones don't rattle at all. If I cranked the amp all the time, they seem to rattle more and more. Myles, from GT, says they should not rattle. I agree, at least as far as new tubes. If they rattle, send them back. Dampners may be necessary for some amps and playing styles.
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Post by mudskipper on Dec 23, 2006 11:32:06 GMT -7
i still don't know why you guys think they rattle. :? if the internals are rattling no damper on the outside helps, as far as i know. i've never had an EL84 rattle, so i don't know what you guys are talking about.
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Post by dgabbear on Dec 23, 2006 14:09:54 GMT -7
I have tapped all the tubes with the amp on, and the culprits are the EL84's. The tubes are very microphonic as they have an amplified rattle. I have ordered a new set of EL84's and wil hope that takes care of the problem. I was more or less curious about how these types of tubes hold up being that I have never ever owned an EL84 operated amp before.
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Post by skydog958 on Dec 23, 2006 18:14:01 GMT -7
Nitehawk, definately hear you on that! Mine is extra punchy w/ my 45 rig. These guitars are totally underrated. What color is yours?
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Post by billyguitar on Dec 23, 2006 19:17:30 GMT -7
I've never had that problem. It's a good thing EL-84s are relatively cheap since they are a bit fragile and wear out so quickly.
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Post by nitehawk55 on Dec 23, 2006 20:18:47 GMT -7
Nitehawk, definately hear you on that! Mine is extra punchy w/ my 45 rig. These guitars are totally underrated. What color is yours? It's a nice tobacco type burst with the black wood pickguard . I got it from a fellow in Taylor MS for $1000 and it was like new being a 2004 model . I like this one because it has the Gibson type bridge , not the Shaller . It also had the Shaller pups which were OK but Ifound a bit thin for my liking .These SD Seth's I just had installed are killer ! I'm using 11-49 Dad's on it which seem to really suit it .
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Post by nitehawk55 on Dec 23, 2006 20:20:11 GMT -7
I have a set of Groove Tube's that rattle too and wonder at the extra cost . I think it was guitargeorge who suggested some time ago that automotive type silicone gasket goop ( for hot applications ) worked well if you ran a bead or 2 of it around the tubes . I have not tried it but I think a couple on here chimed in and said it did remove the rattle and was a cheap fix compared to the damper rings Nighthawk, herbiesaudiolab.home.att.net/Thanks for that info Paul , i'm going to try a set . THese work. All the rattle stoped. Get a set for your EL84's HAHL o 09's for the EL84's and HAL o 27 for the Rectifier. Fixes the problem right away. No need to get automotive gaskets etc... Just get the teflon... really cheap and effective.
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Post by mudskipper on Dec 23, 2006 20:58:03 GMT -7
I have tapped all the tubes with the amp on, and the culprits are the EL84's. The tubes are very microphonic as they have an amplified rattle. I have ordered a new set of EL84's and wil hope that takes care of the problem. I was more or less curious about how these types of tubes hold up being that I have never ever owned an EL84 operated amp before. i don't think i've ever had EL84s go microphonic. this certainly is not to say that yours aren't. what i have noticed is that the vibration of tapping on things in general gets picked up by one (or more) of preamp tube(s), especially the V1 in most cases, and it sounds like it's the power tubes, though. while you are in there, tap on preamp tubes and see if any of them are overly microphonic. like i said, the first gain stage is usually pretty sensitive.
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