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Post by The Bad Poodle Experience on Apr 1, 2014 10:48:24 GMT -7
i know there are lots of threads talking about this but I also know you guys like to talk...
so, got any 12" speaker suggestions for warming up my Ghia?
I bought it with the stock blue upgrade but after 4 years, it's still got this brittle edge to it I'm not happy with.
Would rather try a different speaker before considering changing the amp.
maybe some tube swapping?
thoughts?
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Post by headshrinker (Marc) on Apr 1, 2014 11:07:56 GMT -7
If you have JJs anywhere in it other than maybe the phase inverter, get them out and it will make a big difference. Especially in the power tubes. JJs have an upper mid spike sort of like a Vintage 30 speaker. Couple that with a speaker with lots of uppers like a Blue and it can get brittle. If you can get Tungsol preamps I like them. Mesa's are warmer too (they may be rebranded Sovtecs) and some of the reissue Mullards. A nos 12AX7 will be great too. I also like Sovtec power tubes. Speakerwise you might try something that has more of an American flavor to get more scoop to the frequency response.
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Post by Ridgeback on Apr 1, 2014 11:09:05 GMT -7
50 watt or higher ceramic Silver Bell or Blue Dog. Both would be warmer than a Blue. No personal experience with others. Actually, I really liked the Blue paired with a 50 watt ceramic Blue Dog in a 2x12 cab (not a fan of the Blue as a stand alone speaker). Used that cab with my Ghia for many years. They filled in each others' missing parts nicely as well as upping the power handling to 30 watts so I could be comfortable using the cab with higher powered amps like the Ray. Good luck.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2014 11:55:21 GMT -7
I've been having the same issue as you lately. The fact of the matter is that the Ghia is a very bright amp. I find myself at 2pm or so on the tone knob with a lot of my guitars. I'm currently running a Tone Tubby Alnico, but have been thinking of switching to something warmer. A greenback/creamback, maybe?
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Apr 1, 2014 12:11:29 GMT -7
^^ I agree with Ridgeback on the Silver Bell. When I had my 'Ghia, my favorite speaker was the AlNiCo Scumback Scumnico, a variant of the Vox/silver speaker--similar to the Weber Silver Bell.
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Post by digiTED aka 'Ted' on Apr 1, 2014 12:44:50 GMT -7
I LLLOOOVVVEEE the Scumback M75 with the Ghia incl. both with the Tele and 335. I find the M75's take on the Greenback thing to have more clarity across its range incl the highs as compared to a broken-in Celestion G12M.
Compared directly to the Blue, I'd say you get a little more low end, the mids are similar but shifted slightly lower (and maybe *slightly* less crisp), the highs are considerably smoother, and you get earlier breakup.
Mostly I used a special M75 variant, the 'PVC' (paper voice coil). I believe it's directly related to the G12M Heritage: it's 20w max and supposedly will ignite if pushed too hard (no closed back cabs! LOL), but IMO nails that wonderful crisp articulation in the mids that the Blue is some great at rendering.
I also have a Scumback J75 which raises that breakup point and extends the upper and esp. the lower limits (bigger magnet); otherwise in a similar wheelhouse to the M75.
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Post by The Bad Poodle Experience on Apr 1, 2014 13:24:39 GMT -7
good stuff. thanks guys!
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Post by John on Apr 1, 2014 16:42:15 GMT -7
Maybe a G12-65...with it's big dust cap? But they're so expensive, I'd go with the WGS clone. The ET-65. Never tried one, but lots of people sure like them. Big dust caps help take away fizzy highs.
If you play at high volume, the greenback starts to attenuate some highs. (But a blue is supposed to also...but I don't think quite as much as a greenback.)
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swiveltung
Full Member
tracking number 770638390642
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Post by swiveltung on May 1, 2014 16:05:17 GMT -7
I used a silver bell in my Ghia for quite a while, sounded good, but that speaker kind of emulates the Ghia sound anyway, (Big warm bottom and mids and airy highs?)so I tired of it. Currently using a Weber legacy 55 hz, but it's not a heck of a lot different. I used a RI Jensen C12K for quite a while too and liked it. It blooms at gig volumes and sounds good, def intiely tames the highs, but warning; is warm tested at home to me. Not sure what the ultimate is but tempted to go back and try a greenback or the WGS version of it. a Weber 12A150 is definitely a warm speaker.... |
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Post by muZician on May 1, 2014 23:00:07 GMT -7
I LLLOOOVVVEEE the Scumback M75 with the Ghia incl. both with the Tele and 335. I find the M75's take on the Greenback thing to have more clarity across its range incl the highs as compared to a broken-in Celestion G12M. Compared directly to the Blue, I'd say you get a little more low end, the mids are similar but shifted slightly lower (and maybe *slightly* less crisp), the highs are considerably smoother, and you get earlier breakup. Mostly I used a special M75 variant, the 'PVC' (paper voice coil). I believe it's directly related to the G12M Heritage: it's 20w max and supposedly will ignite if pushed too hard (no closed back cabs! LOL), but IMO nails that wonderful crisp articulation in the mids that the Blue is some great at rendering. I also have a Scumback J75 which raises that breakup point and extends the upper and esp. the lower limits (bigger magnet); otherwise in a similar wheelhouse to the M75. agree absolutely on the Scumbacks M75 PVC. Another thing that helps in case of very bright amps (which are the very good amps...) is in some case changing pickups. I did it with my Tele and my Zwreck got warmer (without loosing the top end ZZZZZ-chime) |
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51d
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Post by 51d on May 8, 2014 9:23:47 GMT -7
I think that Weber Blues provide enhanced bass and mid, although I have to admit I've taken more of them out of my cabinets recently than actually put in...however, I'm about to try a 10" ceramic Blue Pup in a new Zilla cabinet with my Ghia head. But the thought of a Celestion Gold 10" is nagging me, although during my (surprisingly brief) ownership of a Maz 8 Studio the Blue in that didn't weaken my knees. I suspect the 10" Gold might be perfect for the Ghia (as many attest in this forum).
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Post by simpleton on May 8, 2014 9:46:01 GMT -7
Well I'm really of no help since I use 10's with my Ghia BUT since you did say how much we love talking... I use 2 Eminence Legend 10's 16ohm version with my Ghia and it made the highs much nicer for me. It had the Z 10's but I just couldn't get into the overdrive sound of them, it was the tinny edge on the drive sound top end and a brittle sound in there too sorta. I don't know but the Legends really smoothed thing up for me and I absolutely love them. MAYBE the 12 would be what you need; should I drive up from Portland so you can run through the 10's ?
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Post by meanslide on May 8, 2014 12:51:37 GMT -7
Tone Tub Alnico, get one used and well broken in. Best 12" I tried with the CG - it has alot more 'ummphhh' than the Blue.
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Post by The Bad Poodle Experience on May 8, 2014 16:47:16 GMT -7
should I drive up from Portland so you can run through the 10's ? if you insist.  |
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Post by meanslide on May 8, 2014 20:28:54 GMT -7
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Post by rcrecelius on May 8, 2014 20:37:17 GMT -7
Don't rule out a preamp tube change...I just put one of these in my Ghia and it www.kcanostubes.com/content/nos-rft-12ax7 was MUCH better to my ears... I did this along with a NOS 5751 and it sounds sweet like a Ghia should again! |
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51d
Junior Member
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Post by 51d on May 10, 2014 11:25:14 GMT -7
I've just replaced the valves in my CG25th with a matched pair of TAD EL84str, a Groove Tubes 12ax7m, NOS GE 5751, and Phillips JAN 5Y3 rectifier. Compared to the JJs it came with in both power and preamp, this selection is just so much smoother. The TADs and Groove Tube Mullard-alike make a huge difference in my view. There's a nice YouTube of Corey Hicks working a Tele through a TAD-equipped Ghia head and 1x10" cab; sounds good to me, and close to the sound I get. And it is most definitely warmer...
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Post by simpleton on May 10, 2014 12:46:01 GMT -7
should I drive up from Portland so you can run through the 10's ? if you insist. We'll have to plan a trip then  |
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on May 20, 2014 13:10:24 GMT -7
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Post by eggman on May 28, 2014 8:54:54 GMT -7
Howdy,
For the reasons your stated about the Celestion Blue, I slightly prefer Weber's 30 watt AlNiCo Silver Bell. Good bass and better clean tones, albeit at the expense of the Blue's more complex raunch. The Silver Bell is fantastic clean, fwiw.
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~ Ted in SF
