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Post by James on May 13, 2006 13:11:04 GMT -7
Hope everyone's enjoying their Saturday....rainout here in the midwest.....purfect day for playing and listening to music!
Any one experienced a noticeable difference in necks with it vs those without it.........it shure look purty.........I think I heard that Tom Anderson said something to the effect that the bidseye or "knots" in the wood affect the overall resonance and sustain in the "molecules" of the neck...........I hope not, cuz.........its stunning! ( my own wording and not his......just to be accurate here!)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2006 14:00:37 GMT -7
The original neck on my custom shop 69 strat had a Birdseye maple neck. When it came time for a refret the neck kind of gave in for lack of a better term. Highly flamed or birdseye necks do warp much easier than standard maple necks. I replaced my neck with a custom shop quartersawn maple neck with rosewood fingerboard. Instantly more sustain and resonance. While I do love the look of birdseye I don't think I would buy anything with it again only because of it's unstable nature. As far as what Tom Anderson said, I might have to agree. The difference between my old neck and the new one is like night and day. Though my new neck is actually two years older.
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Post by jwr on May 13, 2006 14:01:01 GMT -7
I've got birds eye maple necks on both of my Warmoth guitars, both with no finish. I've gotten compliments of the feel, look and tone of both instruments. One's a Tele and the other a Strat. They both play better and have better sustain than 99% of the Fenders I've ever played, although I recently played one that was magic and it had a normal maple neck. When I build another Warmoth it'll be another birdseye neck. By the way, I wish I was back in Michigan enjoying a rainy day back on the farm:>)
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Post by James on May 13, 2006 14:13:29 GMT -7
good info guys...........thanks! How's things goin' Arun? Been a while since I chatted with ya! Hope all is well in Edmonton..........although, I was not too happy when those oilers knocked my.......RED Wings square out of the p'offs......
Where in MI did you live jwr? Ann Arbor is not quite the farm........but, nonetheless, you got it right to miss a cold rainy day in MI.....just something nice about "nesting" inside............
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2006 14:16:09 GMT -7
Things are going great James. Sorry about bumping the Red Wings out of the playoffs. Nothing personal.
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Post by jwr on May 13, 2006 18:46:06 GMT -7
The farm is only about 35 minutes away from U of M campus actually, I've spent a lot of time around A2. Just outside of Saline. Blind Pig, Bird of Paradise, there's a few good bars with live music in your neighborhood, although I know some of the names have changed. But I'm sure you already knew that, I do miss it. Just saw in Vintage Guitar that the new Peavey Jerry Donahue(spelling might be wrong) guitar has a birds eye maple neck AND board. I've thought of trying that myself. Maybe someday.
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Post by billyguitar on May 13, 2006 22:47:42 GMT -7
Tom Anderson says highly figured wood is not stable and they won't use it. I'll belive him because what do I know?
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Post by benttop (Steve) on May 14, 2006 10:09:57 GMT -7
I have a '67 Tele here that still has the original neck and has been refretted and it is perfect. Beautiful birds-eye maple - no warpage or other deleterious effects.
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Post by James on May 14, 2006 10:12:20 GMT -7
yeah........I was hoping to NOT get this kind of info because there seems to be no consensus.......on one or the other.
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Post by RC on May 14, 2006 12:31:10 GMT -7
The strongest most resistant to cupping, twisting and bending is tight Vertical Grain (VG) wood. It also tends to be less effected by changes in humidity. Basically the straighter and closer the growth rings are together the better. Now before you tar and feather me these are just the characteristic of wood with VG verses wood with birds eye or other types of growth patterns.
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Post by jwr on May 14, 2006 16:41:12 GMT -7
The neck on my Tele is 10-15 yrs old and it's unfinished. Raw. According to Warmoth and everybody else it could/should be warped and useless by now. It's been refretted once and is my best playing/sounding neck I have. Someday it will be useless. Could be tomorrow or 10 years after I'm dead and gone and my son(I'll have one someday hopefully) has to get a new neck for the instrument. Nothing lasts forever and in a crowded bar no one's gonna know the difference. If you like it, give it a shot. It's only money! ;>)
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Post by Hohn on May 15, 2006 6:19:24 GMT -7
My Zion "Strat" has has a birdseye neck and board, but it uses two separate pieces of wood (i.e., board is glued on and you have birdseye over birdseye).
Mine is only 10 years old, so maybe it's too soon to tell, but it's as stable as granite.
Oh, and if figured wood is so unstable, I'm sure Michael DeTemple and a couple others must be uninformed ;D
jh
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Post by jb on May 15, 2006 9:12:42 GMT -7
I bought a guitar from John Suhr and his warranty for birds eye maple necks is only 90 days due to what he refers to as stability issues. He said that he doesn't see a lot of guitars come back with neck problems, but the ones he does see tend to be birds eye maple. They sure look great though.
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maction
Full Member
SRZ for me
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Post by maction on May 15, 2006 10:34:56 GMT -7
I was recently told by a luthier whom I trust that birdseye necks are less stable than straight-grained necks. but "less stable" is, of course, relative to some unmeasurable standard of stability.
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Post by Hohn on May 15, 2006 10:45:37 GMT -7
So the consensus is that BE is less stable, but still pretty sturdy?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2006 11:21:09 GMT -7
I think it is a 'enter at your own risk' kind of thing. You might end up with a great neck or you might not. I think there is a greater chance of warping with 'figured' necks, but that does not mean everyone of them will warp. That being said guys like John Suhr who build a lot of guitars have a short warranty on figured necks for a reason. Another thought a birds-eye neck with a rosewood board might be more stable beacuse of the added ridigity of the rosewood. Maybe?
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Post by RC on May 15, 2006 12:06:40 GMT -7
I think it is a 'enter at your own risk' kind of thing. You might end up with a great neck or you might not. I think there is a greater chance of warping with 'figured' necks, but that does not mean everyone of them will warp. That being said guys like John Suhr who build a lot of guitars have a short warranty on figured necks for a reason. Another thought a birds-eye neck with a rosewood board might be more stable beacuse of the added ridigity of the rosewood. Maybe? Well said Aruntang, I think if you are looking at a neck with light Birds Eye on it you are probable not going to have any issues but I personally would stay away from a neck with a lot of Birds Eye around key stress points like between the 12th and 17th frets on a strat. Hohn also mentioned that on his Zion strat he has a two piece laminated Birds Eye neck and has had no problems. This is an excellent solution. When you laminate two or more piece's together they become stronger and more stable than a one piece of the same size. I think when your paying for this kind of an up grade you need go in to it with a good understanding of the potential problems you might face.
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Post by propellr on May 15, 2006 12:23:24 GMT -7
Yeah, I've done some Q&A sessions with you guys on this subject and have talked with some industry insiders and the solution I've come to is to save the figured wood for the tops of my guitars. There is calculated risk involved with respect to choosing a figured neck on a guitar. The neck may not resonate as well in spots, or may warp or crack, depending on the change in relative humidity, temperature, or a rapid loss of grip by the player! LOL! Sure is purdy, though. I've seen a couple of LPs with birdseye tops and they look GOOD!
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Post by guitarman1 on May 17, 2006 13:05:50 GMT -7
I've had a few Birdseye necks with & without rosewood fret boards and have had no problems (knock on wood). One of them was a Suhr Strat maple/rosewood and it carried the standard warranty. I've not seen/heard this limited warranty mentioned before. Is this something new?
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Post by jb on May 18, 2006 13:05:51 GMT -7
The limited warranty started about six months ago.
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Post by janinedoubly on May 27, 2006 18:37:42 GMT -7
Figured maple, by almost every luthier's standards, is less stable than straight grain maple. But, there are some things to consider and some ways around this to be able to still use bird's or flamed maple and have a stable neck. (1) How long has the wood been sitting to allow for any warpage to "work itself out"? Many small builders, especially DeTemple, only need a few good pieces to work with. If they only need one or two every few months, they can afford to let the good stuff sit around and acclimate. Obviously, DeTemple gives his wood PLENTY of time to come to rest. Some of the larger "boutique" builders do not have this luxury, thus, they don't do it, or they have a "limited" warranty. Don Grosh has told me he lets his bird's sit for a year or so before ever using it and he is REAL picky even with the 1 year old stuff. But, again, he only needs a few pieces every so often, since he only builds 250 guitars a year, if its a good one. (3) The size of the neck can help, too. A bird's eye 1" thick neck will be much more stable than an Ibanez Wizard neck. If you dig baseball bats, you can probably get away with bird's. (3) A second piece for the fingerboard, rosewood or maple can help counteract any flex the bird's might have. Kinda like the Hamer "Stressed neck" system. A large bird's eye neck with a thick piece of Rosewood on top, is pretty stable.
Tonally, I like large (as in size) bird's eye necks. They are a little less punchy than straight grain stuff. A big bird's eye, one piece maple neck, on a light ash body with low output Fralin's or Lollar's is to die for. Very violin like and buttery. But, if you prefer more muscular Strat or Tele tones, get straight grain, it will definitely have more punch. IMO, the type and size of the neck has almost as much affect on the way a guitar sounds as the body does.
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Post by Hohn on May 31, 2006 6:17:20 GMT -7
I agree on the neck being important in tone. I think neck and body are equally important, and the joint between the two is critical.
I've never played one, but PRS made a batch of guits with solid rosewood necks. The tone is supposedly incredible. Seems believeable enough, since rosewood works so well on acoustic guitars. Guess what wood they uses for claves (percussion instrument)?
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Post by billyguitar on May 31, 2006 8:54:07 GMT -7
Tom Anderson occasionally makes guitars with all rosewood necks. I've never played one in a situation where I could really check it out.
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Post by jwr on May 31, 2006 10:36:16 GMT -7
I auditioned a PRS McCarty with a solid Rosewood neck. I liked it, but I went with a regular neck on mine. I couldn't see spending the extra $$. It was a big added expense to the instrument that just didn't seem worth it.
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Post by janinedoubly on May 31, 2006 16:13:09 GMT -7
Rosewood necks do similar things to a guitar that a solid maple neck does. It "solidifies" the tone and gives the basic guitar sound even more punch. Its an aquired taste to my ears. Anderson's rosewood necks on their Cobras and Atoms makes sense if you are looking for added punch and a tigher, more controlled low end. Its great for heavy rock rhythem work and for more muscular playing styles. Subtle it is not!! But its cool on an Andy. I am not as fond of it on a PRS, due to their use of a longer scale length. Its just too much, like giving yourself a headache, but that's just my opinion. It DOES feel really cool though, I will say!!! Like running your hand down a 200 year old bannister railing!
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Post by nitehawk55 on Jun 20, 2006 20:25:41 GMT -7
Well I'm receiving a used G&L Comanche with birdseye neck tomorrow so hopefully no problems .
This is my first posting here BTW and a big hello to all !! ;D
I can honestly say Birdseye is a beautiful wood used on an acoustic guitar body for both looks and tone . My Beneteau OM has the nicest quilted/birdseye maple and has never had any issues .
Just purchased a MAZ 18jr 2X12 this past weekend but still getting to know it . First impressions are looking good !!
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