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Post by Lefty on Jul 24, 2006 9:52:38 GMT -7
Ok guys, we all like distortion now and then. Personally I don't use it for anything other than rhythm chunk when the occasional Skynard/ZZ Top tune is on the set list. I've tried for many years to get around NOT having a pedal to cover that territory, but it seems to be a necessary evil to keeping a well rounded pedal board. Better to have and not need...
My problem is, seeing as I don't use it for anything other than unity levels they tend to sound thin and trebly. I don't want it to push my amp just meld with it and certainly not to increase the volume. And lets face it, as with most OD's and distortion devices they don't sound good at lower levels. I've been through them all. Here's a few that come to mind.
TB Classic-sounds good, but AC adapter and foot print were a problem. Not to mention when you get it dialed in, it's something very different with a band.
AM/Keeley DS-1-both very cool, and very different. But sound better with the vol up.
Original Expandora-this used to be my main distortion, sold it years ago, bought another...not the same. Bought a reissue, not the same.
Rat/Vintage Rat-both cool, but a bit dark and compressed at times.
AM SD-9-great if you're playing 80's hair metal.
Fulltone DS Pro-I could never stop turning knobs, sounds ok at best with lots of volume.
And many many many more over the years. So recently I've been doing some research. Why get a pedal that is meant to push/mix with an amp? What is needed is some sort of "emulator" not a creator. So I took the plunge and ordered a V-Stack Classic. It's meant to be more of a DI to either PA/PC but also can be used in front of an amp. I may be chasing my tail with this one, but who knows...maybe I'm on the right track with this one? Anyone had any experiences with one?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2006 10:15:46 GMT -7
I've tried the V-Stack straight in to Pro Tools and it does sound like a killer Marshall. As far as with amps it was a bit harder to dial it in. I unfortunately did not get enough time with it and my amps to be able make a final judgement. Lefty, don't you find that with your drive pedals set to Unity Gain when the band starts playing that your volume drops when you turn on your drive pedal? I have always had to turn my drive pedals up louder than my Clean sound to have it sound like it is at Unity in front or on the stage when the band is playing. I have always had that problem. It sounded great by myself at soundcheck with my pedal set to Unity but when we checked the whole band playing a tune, I would have to crank the pedal just to sound at the same level as my clean sound. Weird huh?
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Post by Lefty on Jul 24, 2006 11:04:22 GMT -7
Yea I've read it's a little harder to dial in with an amp, but I'm willing to try it. They recommend an amp with a flat EQ, well my Maz 18 EQ is somewhat flat. But there's always room for tweaking.
Yea it's hard to get drive pedals to not over power or under power. I think it's because of the excentuated high end/grind they produce, your eear tends to hear it quicker than a clean tone. Unity or just above unity, as long as it sounds good!
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Post by guitarman1 on Jul 24, 2006 11:49:06 GMT -7
I've tried the V-Stack straight in to Pro Tools and it does sound like a killer Marshall. As far as with amps it was a bit harder to dial it in. I unfortunately did not get enough time with it and my amps to be able make a final judgement. Lefty, don't you find that with your drive pedals set to Unity Gain when the band starts playing that your volume drops when you turn on your drive pedal? I have always had to turn my drive pedals up louder than my Clean sound to have it sound like it is at Unity in front or on the stage when the band is playing. I have always had that problem. It sounded great by myself at soundcheck with my pedal set to Unity but when we checked the whole band playing a tune, I would have to crank the pedal just to sound at the same level as my clean sound. Weird huh? I'm glad you mentioned this, 'cause I have the exact same problem. I've never mentioned it to anyone before and haven't heard anyone else talk about until now. Now I know I'm only a little crazy, instead of completely nutz!
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Post by tjstrat on Jul 24, 2006 13:01:44 GMT -7
I notice this too. I'm having a h3ll of a time dialing my Zen Drive in, and at unity it just disappears. Therefore I set it a little higher and when I switch to clean Mr Plinky is on lead guitar foer awhile. And about every overdrive or distortion is the same way...
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Post by Curt on Jul 24, 2006 13:09:36 GMT -7
I'm with ya'll here too guy's...mind blowing really. Much worse IMO when running all miked through a house system than when stage volume only is being used.
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Post by Lefty on Jul 24, 2006 13:27:44 GMT -7
That's why I set my lead pedal high, and roll back the volume for clean unity stuff.
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Post by billyguitar on Jul 24, 2006 13:54:03 GMT -7
The more saturation the more the sound shrinks into the background, IMO.
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Post by tjstrat on Jul 24, 2006 16:19:00 GMT -7
I HAVE had a lot of success with Lefty's approach using the OCD. That pedal cleans up better than anything I've ever played. Problem is I also have this cool NEW toy I wanna put in the mix...
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Post by garyh on Jul 24, 2006 16:42:17 GMT -7
That's so true. The problem is the sound check. I always set my overdrive volume the same as my clean volume until after the band starts playing a couple of bars and then turn it up. Otherwise, the guys in the band(s) get upset and tell me to turn down when they hear me by myself getting a sound and proper volume set for the room/stage. They don't understand!!
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Post by quinto on Jul 24, 2006 18:46:08 GMT -7
Yes, I to have noticed this. I finally just set 'em a little higher.
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Post by Hohn on Jul 25, 2006 11:51:28 GMT -7
It has to do with the way we perceive sound.
At sound check, you are often playing by yourself, just doing basic A/B with clean and dirty.
But during the show, you have an entirely different background. Remember, our human ears only perceive DIFFERENCES in sound, not absolute sound. So the background plays a HUGE role in dialing in levels and tones.
You've seen this before, when you've dialed in a killer tone earlier, only to have it completely disappear from the show mix unless you drastically change levels. Very frustrating for all parties. This is where a little parametric EQ can be nice-- just adjust a band up or down until it sits in the mix at the same level.
The other ingredient in this is the natural, inevitable compression that happens at higher levels with an OD on. This takes the impact off your peaks, and tends to push it lower in the mix.
Another thing I've found helpful is the following rule: "If you keep disappearing in the mix, turn the gain down." Given to me by a much better player than I and it's proven to be a good maxim.
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Post by Lefty on Jul 29, 2006 11:51:28 GMT -7
V-Stack Classic- A #1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It doesn't get any better than this!! Amazing! It took me 2 minutes to dial it in with my Maz 18. Simlply killer.
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Post by G'OlPeachPhan on Jul 31, 2006 13:56:36 GMT -7
V-Stack Classic- A #1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It doesn't get any better than this!! Amazing! It took me 2 minutes to dial it in with my Maz 18. Simlply killer. Glad it worked out for you Lefty! Another pedal of interest (and I don't know for sure yet) may be the olcircuits.com "Thunderchief." It's supposed to be a transistorized pedal version of the Marshall Super Lead... so it's actually the same circuit as the amp, but translated to a stompbox. I'm building it right now... time will tell!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2006 14:04:32 GMT -7
V-Stack Classic- A #1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It doesn't get any better than this!! Amazing! It took me 2 minutes to dial it in with my Maz 18. Simlply killer. Glad it worked out for you Lefty! Another pedal of interest (and I don't know for sure yet) may be the olcircuits.com "Thunderchief." It's supposed to be a transistorized pedal version of the Marshall Super Lead... so it's actually the same circuit as the amp, but translated to a stompbox. I'm building it right now... time will tell! You definitely have to let us know how the pedal turns out PeachPhan. Sounds like a cool pedal! Lefty glad the pedal worked out man! A friend of mine is going to lend me his V-Stack to try. He's been raving about it for months. Those Canadians sure like their Drive pedals.
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Post by Lefty on Jul 31, 2006 14:13:42 GMT -7
I think the "cab simulation" of the V-stack is one of the nice parts of the pedal. It get's you into the "Wall of Marshalls" feel/sound with out the back strain and ear bleed. The clean up factor (with guitar vol) is amazing. Who-da thunk?
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