|
Post by kidmagic on Jul 11, 2006 10:23:00 GMT -7
O.k. it's on, I just purchased a used 6545 from a guy on-line and it's supposed to be in the mail right now! Wow I seriously can't wait.... Little scared because I've never played one, but being a current Mazerati owner, and a former Z-28 owner I know how great the DR's amps are and I figured I'd probably be o.k.
Any tips on how to get the SRZ side really beefed up in the mids with lots of overdrive? I read some stuff on HC about mods, which I may consider once I get a chance to play it a bit (think the SRZ side might end up being a bit too clear for me - I play modern, hard rock, not metal, and well I'm probably not the best player in the world, so a little blur might be nice). But if there is a tube answer, I'd rather go that route first.. Thanks
|
|
|
Post by kidmagic on Jul 11, 2006 14:14:37 GMT -7
By the way, this is what was posted on a harmony-central review (which strangely has now been removed.. weird.). Any amp techs out there have any thoughts about these proposed mods??
"SRZ 65 side: I had some issues with regarding the tone. Notice on the Pro Guitar demo soundbyte (linked on the Dr Z site) the tone controls are set treble-10, mid-10, and bass-3. I didn't like the mid character and the bottom end either. This side is more traditionally designed similar to early Marshall/Bassman, with one exception, there is another gain stage since there is only one input instead of two pairs. So it's more like a JCM 800 in that respect with 3 stages + cathode follower rather than 2 stages + cathode follower, and of course the master volume which follows the tone stack. Again the tone stack is Fender style 56K slope, 250pF/250k treb, 0.047mF/10k Mid, 0.1mF/250k bass.
I changed to more of Marshall model 1959 stack values of 33k slope, 500pF/250k treb, 0.015mF/25k Mid, 0.022mF/1M bass. The 0.015 mid cap is a little unusual but I like the increased lower mids that brings over a stock Marshall 0.022. The 0.022 for the bass cap raises the cut-off frequency of the lower bass notes making it less muddy/flabby on the bottom, even though some of those frequencies are below the 100Hz guitar low E.
Then for the really fun part I wanted to get more gain, and within the 3 gain stages the second one only has a 10K cathode resistor and no bypass cap. The hot trick for JCM 800s was to drop that second stage cathode resistor to 5K by adding another 10K in parallel across the same terminals as the existing 10k. For even more gain lower the resistor to 2.7K, and/or place a 0.68mF bypass cap as well. That my friends is waaaaaay too much. Had to turn the gain down to about 3. So I left the cap off the cathode. But the point is there's tons more gain to be had if you need it, I just need to be prudent about not going too far."
|
|
|
Post by Paul (TRANE) on Jul 11, 2006 15:45:08 GMT -7
kidmagic,
Welcome to Z family. I love my 6545. I have not had to mod it at all. I did go NOS on the tubes and the difference was amazing. Using my Les Paul I get a great thick sound with great articulation and clarity. I generally run the amp pretty hot as well. Since you got your amp used, one of the first things to do would be to have it checked out by a competent tech and replace the tubes. Just a good thing to do when buying any amp used. I have not had any issues with the amount of mids on the amp and look forward to hearing how you like it.
Paul G.
|
|
|
Post by benttop (Steve) on Jul 11, 2006 20:18:33 GMT -7
Welcome to 6545 land! I seriously dig mine, although the Stingray popped up and so I've been a bit distracted for the moment. But the 6545 is a way cool amp! Check the sounds forum for several clips that I put up, and several others - I'm not sure you need a lot more gain unless you're playing metal. The amp has quite a bit as shipped! Check it out!
|
|
|
Post by kidmagic on Jul 12, 2006 9:59:32 GMT -7
Thanks fellas.. Yew, I think I'm probably too excited, and Benttop your MFN and wankage tracks are probably what pushed me over the edge to purchase the 6545. I've read every post in the 6545, kt-45, and SRZ65 sections, as well as every Harmony-central review and few odd posts on the thegearpage.net. I've just noticed a number of people who use the 45 side a lot, but are not totally sold on the 65 side. Maybe I will be, but thinking ahead, hearing that mods are relatively easy and possible, and being to change the tone stack to a more marshall structure coupled with more gain, has made me think, o.k. buy quality, and then if you need to make changes to it, do it.
I've been using a Mazerati head through a celestion loaded 2x12 almost exclusively for the past 1 - 1 1/2 years. And with this new band I've joined, I just needed to step-up into a more dirty rock and roll feel, with more volume and power. Sounds crazy but the Mazerati is just barley hanging in there.
By the way, I also just ordered a Avatar 4x10's loaded with the eminence ramrod speakers, both are set to arrive this week.. That could your fault too benttop!
|
|
|
Post by benttop (Steve) on Jul 12, 2006 19:40:00 GMT -7
Keep one thing in mind with the 6545 - no matter how you approach your speakers, you are flirting with a compromise. If you put the speakers in that sound great with the lead sounds on the 65 side, they are likely to be a bit midrangey on the 45 side. Likewise, if you pick speakers that sound great clean, they may not give you exactly the sound you want on the lead side. I like the sound of both sides, but I like each side with different speakers. I'm thinking about a trial of a combination cab here - one with a pair of Alnicos for the top end, and a pair of ceramics like a V30 for the mids and tight bottom. That may be a way to get what I'm looking for from this amp.
|
|
|
Post by kidmagic on Jul 14, 2006 9:16:41 GMT -7
I'll be very curious to hear the amp through my 2x12 cab and my new 4x10. The 2x12 is two celestions ( 1 V30, 1 g12h), it's detuned, which is like a 4x12 sealed back cab, but with only 2 speakers loaded. Big, big sound, but actuallly seems like the mids are scouped, or maybe that is just the nature of the Mazerati. The 4x10 is loaded with Emininence ramrods, it's an open back cab. Hopefully I'll be happy with those for while, and then I can concentrate on tubes for a bit.
I priced out some NOS tubes trane has noted on his ealier post ("6545 - Re-tubed and sounding georgous"). Man those Brimar 12ax7 are expensive!! Not sure I'm going that route just yet. Anyone try the RFT 12ax7/ecc83's? Watford valves had a pretty favorable review of them, noted they break-up pretty early and definitel a rock tube, and they are half the price of the Brimars.
Clear rookie on tubes, so bear with me. What position is the phase inverter on the 6545? V2? the phase inverter needs a tube with "balanced triodes" right?
Any benefit to a balance triodes for position V1?
what does position V3 do? noted that Trane has a Sovtek 12ax7lps there, is that position not as important to your tone. (say that be cause you have $80 tubes in V1, & V2, but a $10 tube in V3).
I have the EF86 covered with a NOS GEC EF86, from when I had a Z28.
|
|
|
Post by Paul (TRANE) on Jul 14, 2006 9:59:12 GMT -7
Actually what I am running is
V1 Brimar CV4004 V2 Brimar CV4004 V3 GEC EF86 V4 Balanced Brimar CV4004 (Phase Inverter)
The V1 is the first gain stage for the SRZ-65 side. No need for a balanced triode in V1 or V2. V3 is the first stage for the KT-45 side. V4 is the Phase Inverter. The phase inverter is critical for driving hte pawer section uniformly....not sure of the overall impact on the tone....getting a bad or poorly balanced one feeds the power tubes poorly. RFT tubes are great tubes. I know that Myles and a lot of folks love them in this amp. They would be a great choice too. Hope this is helpful.
Paul G.
|
|
|
Post by Paul (TRANE) on Jul 14, 2006 10:14:30 GMT -7
Here is some info from Myles that is actually on this forum. "Actually ... I was just talking about this in an email this morning and this is what I wrote: The other day I was working with Buddy Whittington who had received a KT-45 from Dr. Z with the new GT-EL34Ms in it and he raved about it. I have used the M's in the SRZ-65 at this point and they are pretty nice. It really boils down to player's taste but an EL-34M in a #5-6 rating biased at 36mA in the SRZ-65, KT-45, or 6545 seems to be a great setup. In the EF86 position of your amp I prefer the Mullard EF86. You can get these from Mike at KCA ... www.kcanostubes.com I will send a copy of this to him so you two can converse if you want to go that route. These are at: www.kcanostubes.com/content/estore_details.asp?category=&product=141In V1, your first gain stage for the 65 side of the 6545, the best tubes I have heard in these amps are either the RFT: www.kcanostubes.com/content/estore_details.asp?category=&product=14or if you have the money ... the Brimar, which is the best tube I ever heard in the 6545 or SRZ-65 - kcanostubes.com/content/estore_details.asp?category=&product=31I am basically pretty lazy when it comes to shopping and sort of prefer one stop shopping.... so ... for the phase inverter I would go with a long plate LPS and Mike has balanced versions of these that are killer and cheap to boot: kcanostubes.com/content/estore_details.asp?category=&product=22On the phase inverter I would ask mike if on his VTV unit he could find one that read above 105 on each side. On a conventional tube tester that measures transconductance I would want one that was at 1500 or above. I prefer the vacuum tube rectifier in these amps and a good 5AR4 / GZ34 will still be crisp and focused as they have a very fast rise time. Myles" Hope this is helpful. Paul G.
|
|
|
Post by kidmagic on Jul 14, 2006 12:13:56 GMT -7
Wow Paul, that's exactly what I was looking for, thanks! Great info. Rocking 3 Brimars! Wow, one day perhaps. I just placed my order at KCA for the NFT's and a balanced LPS (the mid-level budget NOS solution!). I hope the power tubes are in good shape so I don't have to address that too. By the way have you heard of TAD 12ax7/7025?
|
|
|
Post by Paul (TRANE) on Jul 14, 2006 13:34:09 GMT -7
Glad the info helped you. TUBE AMP DOCTOR tubes. I believe, from all I have heard, that they are kind of like Groove Tubes only TAD is in Europe. Have only heard positive things about their tubes. However, I have not used their stuff up till now. Are you getting an EF86 from KCA as well? The Mullard is a real bargain for NOS as most new production ones do not come up to spec. Just curious on the EF86.
Paul G.
|
|
|
Post by kidmagic on Jul 18, 2006 9:06:49 GMT -7
I have a GEC NOS EF86 from when I owned a z28. I think that tube cost me $80 all-in, so I yanked it out of the Z28 before I sold it. So I think I'm all set there. Wouldn't you believe it though, there was delay in the shipping, so I still haven't received the amp yet, today is the day though!!!
|
|
|
Post by kidmagic on Jul 18, 2006 12:53:47 GMT -7
By the way, played my Mazerati head through the 4x10, loaded with the eminence ramrods.. Wow, what a difference, feels like a totally different amp. Super early break-up, warmer, a bit mushier, less bass, less highs, possibly more mids. My 2x12 w/celestions seems more high-fi, if that makes sense. Really crazy the difference, I was absolutely loving the overdriven sound, but couldn't get a chiming clean at volume. I'm going to have a lot to digest with the new 4x10cab, new 6545, and new tubes (I also ordered new pre-amps tubes for my mazerati, along with the RFT's 12ax7's for the 6545).
|
|
|
Post by billyguitar on Jul 18, 2006 13:21:26 GMT -7
Be sure the impedance is right with the Mazerati and the 4 x 10. Doesn't matter so long as the cab is plugged into the appropriate output jack. A mismatch here could cause less headroom and less highs than you had before. If everything is okay here you need some lower gain preamp tubes to get your clean back.
|
|
|
Post by kidmagic on Jul 19, 2006 8:15:13 GMT -7
O.k. - I got to play the 6545 last night at rehearsal. It's exactly what I was looking for - definitely more in line with rock tones, and I can feel the mids more. I gotta say I was really impressed with the 65 side, great power and amazing rythm crunch tones. Really really nice.
The 45 side seemed to have significantly less power, which was a surprised. I had the volume dimed, and it was barley keeping up with the 65 side (master at 9, gain at 3 o'clock). I'm guessing the EF86 in there is crap and that's why? I haven't changed any of the pre-amp tubes yet, I think they're all the original groove tubes that came from the factory. Happily, it sits idle very quietly (when cranked too), so I'm pretty certain the power tubes are still good. I'll report back once I've had a chance to swap to the NOS pre-amp tubes and give it a good run through.
|
|
|
Post by Paul (TRANE) on Jul 20, 2006 15:53:47 GMT -7
kidmagic,
Be sure and let us know how you like the amp with the new tubes in it. Glad you liked the 65 side. I think once you change out the EF86 the KT-45 side will come to life for you.
Paul G.
|
|
|
Post by jimmydeez on Jul 21, 2006 7:57:33 GMT -7
O.k. - I got to play the 6545 last night at rehearsal. It's exactly what I was looking for - definitely more in line with rock tones, and I can feel the mids more. I gotta say I was really impressed with the 65 side, great power and amazing rythm crunch tones. Really really nice. The 45 side seemed to have significantly less power, which was a surprised. I had the volume dimed, and it was barley keeping up with the 65 side (master at 9, gain at 3 o'clock). I'm guessing the EF86 in there is crap and that's why? I haven't changed any of the pre-amp tubes yet, I think they're all the original groove tubes that came from the factory. Happily, it sits idle very quietly (when cranked too), so I'm pretty certain the power tubes are still good. I'll report back once I've had a chance to swap to the NOS pre-amp tubes and give it a good run through. Yeah there is something wrong if the 45 side can't keep up with the 65 at 9 o'clock. When you get the new EF86 in there crank the Bass and Highs on the 45 side and set the volume to taste. Past 10 o'clock it will blow your socks off.
|
|
|
Post by kidmagic on Jul 21, 2006 9:51:01 GMT -7
O.k., got my new tubes in and ran her through her paces last night at rehearsal. Uhhhhhh.. yew, I definitely made the right choice here. Granted I’m like the kid who just got laid for the first time, and I’m only days into the “honey moon” period, but this amp smokes! I ran it through an Avatar 4x10 semi-open back cab, playing my USA 62 RI jaguar. I have to thank you guys for the tube recommendations, there is a noticeable improvement with the NOS. For a quick review here’s what I got going:
V1 NOS RFT 12ax7 V2 NOS RFT 12ax7 V3 NOS GEC EF86 V4 Sovtek 12ax7LPS (balanced 105/105) GT EL-34S, #6 GT 5AR4/GZ34
For starters the 45 side has great great tone. I still noticed a bit less power, but it really helped to crank the bass and treble (and it definitely gets loud enough). I think I ended up bass dimed, treble at 2, volume at 3. At that point, it’s clean, clear with very nice warmth, very touch sensitive, and a nice chime with light picking, but fattens up with heavier playing. Hard to describe how nice this clean is, just fantastic. Not a bad sound coming out of the jaguar, which is tough to do, trust me, there are many amps that just don’t vibe with that thing.
I LOVE THE 65 side. I just haven’t had a down and dirty rock amp in a long-time, and the crunch is fantastic. It’s exactly what I wanted, something that gets nasty, but is still very touch sensitive. I can back off a bit and it cleans up nicely, even running the gain pretty high. (dimed bass & mids, 1 o’clock treble, gain 3, Master 9-10). Or dig-in and let it roar. I’ve own some really nice distortion, overdrive, Fuzz & boost pedals, and have run them into great amps (z-28, the Mazerati), but you just can’t simulate this sound /feel, it’s great.
I ran some peddles through both sides, and they all sounded great, delay, trem, phase, boosts, fuzz.. Eventually I’ll get around to trying it out with my other guitars, a grosh tele w/90s and a vintage les paul standard. Looking forward to seeing how it interacts with the bigger pickups.
Yew, so what can I say, I'm really happy with this amp. I have had many amps come and go until I found the Mazerati. It has been my main amp for about a year and a half, and it will always have a place, but I think it's going to take a little rest for while.
|
|
|
Post by jimmydeez on Jul 24, 2006 7:46:42 GMT -7
Cool sounds like you made the right choice.
I love my 6545.
|
|
|
Post by cementman on Jul 26, 2006 21:02:58 GMT -7
we are sold on our blonde 6545 head,,,2004 model.. my son uses the 65 side for randy rhoads (aint he dead?) and i use the 45 side for lower volume acoustic but with various electric single coils and p-90 guitars, and humbucks...with a matching z 2/10 cab,,, fits real nice on there, light and easy to get to places to play/.bought used and the thing drips tone..power. have the myles sag kit, 12ax7 setup for the clean side a some others for the hotter side.... big tone in small package
|
|