daz
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by daz on Apr 3, 2008 7:16:55 GMT -7
I work with a resident band doing 6 nite/wk gigs for a few months at a time.To avoid the 'Russian roulette' of venue house amps I've been taking an RXES head and love it, but have a chance at a Z28. I fly to all my gigs and the benefit is simply less weight and the smaller size of the Z28.With such low baggage allowance these days every lb helps. Additionally I run the RX with a hotplate at the 4db cut (which I could leave at home) and I've always partially baffled my speakers. Would the Z28 keep up volume wise - assuming I'm using the same speaker.The speaker is whatever's in the house amp.I disconnect the head and use it as a cab.Not perfect, but a whole lot better option than none at all.
I've had some experience using a house deluxe reissue that kept up ok, but did'nt sound so great and was up at 7-8.After just a few days a stock GT6v6 (EH ?) tube went.
So do you recommend the Z28 for house gigging ?
For reference this is an everything band.Bill Haley to Zeppelin to Police to Maroon 5 .... if that narrow's it down enough, hehe.
Thx in advance. Daz
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Post by asattwanger on Apr 3, 2008 13:47:44 GMT -7
. I fly to all my gigs. Bill Haley to Zeppelin to Police to Maroon 5 .... Thx in advance. Daz Quite the gig you have to be flown to all the gig to play covers. I wouldn't know why not. Tubes are gonna go bad sooner or later no matter who's amp it's in. Running them hard does the number on them, but it's your job to keep up on your amp maintance. I plan on gigging full time with mine. Mine sees 3hrs a night at my house. Wouldn't understand why a axtra hour would hurt it any.
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daz
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by daz on Apr 3, 2008 14:16:27 GMT -7
I've done resident club and hotel gigs for years in Dubia etc, now it's cruise ships.It's a really good gig despite what you might imagine,hehe.I'll be cruising the Med most of this year. I find most similar working guitarists have some digital effort allowing them to travel light, but I just can't go that route.I did try it but I like natural tones. I've carried and gigged a THD Univalve up to the RXES.The Z28 would get me that bit lighter and smaller.I've heard one and I like it,it's just difficult to asses the relative volume when there's no drums or keys bashing away.
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Post by psj1026 (Pete) on Apr 3, 2008 14:48:16 GMT -7
I can't imagine you would have any trouble. It's PFL for a 22 watt amp.
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Post by fishman on Apr 3, 2008 15:34:47 GMT -7
not to mention upping one knob and decreaseing the other adds a bunch of different options. it does not just cut or boost, even say lowering the treble changes the entire response of the amp, adjusting the bass alters it even more...complex simplicity.....great amp...it is my favorite (at the moment) of the Z's I have used/owned...great amp..no question about that..
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Post by asattwanger on Apr 3, 2008 18:18:29 GMT -7
If your have a PA that you all get reinforced by. Why not try a Huges and Kettner Tubman? 3 channels, foot switchable, alot smaller than a head, about a 1/4 the weight and still your tube driven. And H&K started the cab simulator with the Red Box and it very good.
At $100 more than a road case will cost you for the head. Might be worth a try.
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daz
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by daz on Apr 3, 2008 18:58:50 GMT -7
Funny enough I just sold my Tubeman (if the $$ shows up),it was one of the alternate options I used before.It's fine for a while, but this aint just the odd set, it's every night for 4 months or more.It makes you really miss the dynamics of an actual amp.
I did look at the Tiny Terror, but I figured it'd have a similar range to my Univalve, ie little headroom.And of course , the Z's sound much better.
Thanks for the input.
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Post by cisspcism on Apr 4, 2008 5:26:04 GMT -7
My Z28 doesnt seem like it would be loud enough for a gig, unless the drummer was playing soft. I am using it in a 2x12. Its lud but not as loud as I expected for 22 watts
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Post by ericcongdon on Apr 4, 2008 8:27:02 GMT -7
My Z28 doesnt seem like it would be loud enough for a gig, unless the drummer was playing soft. I am using it in a 2x12. Its lud but not as loud as I expected for 22 watts Really? I thought the Z28 was loud as hell. Much louder than my Marshall DSL401 which is rated at 40 watts. Plenty loud for my club gigs.
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Post by groovergeorge on Apr 4, 2008 8:54:54 GMT -7
My Z28 doesnt seem like it would be loud enough for a gig, unless the drummer was playing soft. I am using it in a 2x12. Its lud but not as loud as I expected for 22 watts What speakers are in your 2x12? Greenies? I have been using my Z28 with a tonker recently and it's loud and clear. As a small gigging amp I'd rate the Z28 on par with the Maz Jr although the Maz might just be a little more versatile and does come with reverb if you want it.
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daz
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by daz on Apr 4, 2008 10:27:47 GMT -7
Thanks for the input.I know it's relative to everyone's band situation, but this is the kind of info I've been looking for. I've gigged many times with a Univalve and a V30/H30 cab, even without mic'ing.But add a 2nd guitar or keyboard and what dynamic range there is, is gone.Likewise if the band gets too excited during a solo.There's just not enough headroom. I used a reissue Deluxe on a ship and it was fine,surely a 2x12 would've been better.I ran it pretty hot and had a tube failure, but apparently there's a whole lot of GT(Fender) 6v6 failures in that amp, so I don't think it was just down to me. With the RXES and Hotplate at 4db cut, I wonder if the Z28 might be in the same ballpark volume-wise.And yes there is a PA, but it's nice to feel you have some headroom. I buy amps to use, and for my work situations the old Marshalls and Fenders are physically too big and heavy to fly with.I've taken the RXES as a carry-on, and (gasp !!) as luggage.It's a great sounding, solidly built amp.On almost every cruise I get someone asking about 'the red Z amp'. Thx again.
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Post by asattwanger on Apr 4, 2008 18:37:50 GMT -7
When I first jammed with my Z-28 with other guitar player at loud volumes it seamed like it wasn't as loud as my 12w Fender, but that was with a closed back 2x12. I played it again at the same settings band wise, but this time I used the Fender as a open back cab and boom there was the volume that seamed to be missing.
We'll see what the open back 2x10 Z cab that came today sound like on Sunday.
DAVE
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Post by sudsysul on Apr 5, 2008 7:20:29 GMT -7
I find it hard to understand the difference of opinions with the Z28 headroom. Of course, if you're talking about the head (which I have), then volume is subject to the cabinet and speakers you use. But I find the Z28 to be a very powerful amplifier. I have used mine, complete with cement mixer drummer, with all manner of cabinets.. a 1X12, 2x12 open, 2x12 closed back, and old Marshall 4x12. I rotate between the Z28, a JTM45 and a JMP50 head, mostly based upon room size, but also based upon boredom. The Z28 is as loud as the JTM45, but with less bass content of course. I have a Princeton II combo with the same power tube compliment and the Z28 w/ 1X12 is waaay louder. I've also had the Orange Tiny Terror, nice sounding amp for rock tones, but no where near the headroom. So daz, to address your inquiry, the Z28 head weighs only 18lbs. You could get a soft "clam" bag cover and carry it on the plane very handily. I guess it gets down to if you first like the tones you get with a Z28, and as for headroom considerations, what speakers you are provided at the gig. But I wouldn't think you'd be able to blame the Z28 for not being loud enough unless someone shows up with a 100 watt Marshall stack, and there's no mic'ing going on. Cheers!
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Post by ericcongdon on Apr 5, 2008 7:39:56 GMT -7
I just did my first gig with my Z28 w/ my band, and uh, the friggin Z28 was a monster. I was going through a 1x12 Greenie cab, and it was LOUD I had it on 5 with tone controls at about the halfway point.
Granted it wasn't a huge room, but a nice size, I did not mic it and my drummer was giving me "the look" like dude WTF?
Heh heh I told him I just had to crank this bad boy first time out!
BTW, what an incredible sounding amp. The TONE, holy crap.
Is it loud enough? For most club gigs, HELL YES.
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daz
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by daz on Apr 5, 2008 7:57:02 GMT -7
Thanks lads for the last couple of posts.I was concerned with prior opinions that it doesn't have the power to keep up on stage.Your examples gave me a good reference I can relate to. Of course the speakers make a big difference, and I'm stuck with whatever's on the ship.I've put my RXES through spks from Cyber twins, reissue twins, fender chorus, deville ... all with differing results, but far better than having to use those amps. Decent tube amps (or any) on ships are pretty rare.I was given a reissue twin to use on one ship with 3 of 4 dead power tubes.They didn't know and when I told them they assured me they'd get new 'bulbs' for it. After being stuck with a Line 6 spider 'toy' for 2 months on a ship I decided I'd bring my own head from there on.
Once again, thx for the input. Daz
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Post by groovergeorge on Apr 6, 2008 21:43:10 GMT -7
You mentioned a smaller size chassis. I'm not sure if my suggestion would be suitable but how about a KT45 and a couple of good pedals. The 45' is a great platform clean,takes pedals beautifully and if you aren't loud enough for the audience on those ships the patrons might need to wear there hearing aids because that amp can shake glasses on tables when cranked.
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Post by UnclePat on Apr 7, 2008 11:00:52 GMT -7
They didn't know and when I told them they assured me they'd get new 'bulbs' for it. LOL @ "bulbs" ;D (sorry about the misfortune, but that is funny right there!) ;D
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daz
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by daz on Apr 7, 2008 14:47:59 GMT -7
Yes, I was laughing too, but only on the inside.It looked like I was going to be stuck with a Fender Chorus (shudder) until I persisted enough and found a spare Twin in storage.But even that one had issues. Anyway this thread came about because I know someone with a Z28 on offer.The size, weight and lesser power got me thinking, I was just concerned with the practicality of 22 watts on stage (not that dragging around an RXES , easily my most expensive amp, is really practical).I simply can't live without real tube sound and feel for months at a time.For the odd pool set etc I can make do with a decent drive box into a crap amp, but not every night. Thx again all. Daz
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Post by asattwanger on Apr 7, 2008 15:48:30 GMT -7
I'll be really honest with you as my recent experience really opened my eye to some thing.
If your not sure you'll be able to run the Z-28 into a good speaker, your band plays loud, and you need clean headroom. I can't say that it will be the amp for you. If you guys don't play very loud. Then yeah, because I think it sounds great both ways. Se my Cab at practice thread if you haven't already.
With that said. I'll say this. Dude you have a Rx it's 19" W, 9 3/4" H, 9 1/2" D; 22 lbs. The Z-28 is not that much lighter or smaller. It's not like a Mesa Trem-o-verb head compaired to a Z-28, you know?
If the money isn't an issue {tax write off} then yeah go for it. You get a new tone and if it doesn't work out you can always come here and sell it again.
But, if money is tight and your not really sure. I wouldn't. You have a great amp already.
Personaly, I wouldn't fly with the amp. I would get a road case and a junk box that fits tight and ship it to the city your next port is at. Yeah it's $40. every time you ship it, but now your not lugging your stuff around on the plane.
Ex- all that crap do it the right way. Get a extra small 1x12 cab made that fits under your head. Go to rockhardcases.com talk to him {sorry forgot his name} about making a luggage style road case for your gear. I have seen them. Tele-scoping handle on top and the rollers on the one side.
Dude that is your ticket. I have it drawn up in my head right now. Without it being a live in style case. You'll be able to have all your gear in one little case that you can carry on. Cab, Head, cables, tuner,Hotplate, maybe even a small pedal board, and room for some other stuff. But, I don't have the airlines diamentions or know what RockHard requires as safe padding, but I believe it could work.
That is what I'd be after. Screw useing some POS house amp/speakers.
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daz
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by daz on Apr 7, 2008 18:41:21 GMT -7
Money not an issue .... hehe.Hmm that sure aint me.Tax write-off .... yep.I claim everything from picks to amps to socks.I'm technically self employed working as a contractor to Royal Caribbean or Princess cruises.
Actually the Z28 I'm being offered is a really,really good deal.Here in Canada boutique stuff is a little rarer and more expensive.I'll probably pick it up and add it to the amp family regardless of taking it on the ship.I simply like what I've heard from them. As for shipping gear, well the next contract starts in Finland.If it was just x-country it would make sense.And we could very well be sailing around Asia/Australia this time next year. The pedalboard goes in my suitcase, guitar on my shoulder, and the 2nd 'case' is the amp and odds+sods.Everything left loose gets stuffed into my laptop/carry-on bag.I've recieved some very odds looks and questions over these 'strange' objects in my bag.Try explaining what a vacuum tube is to an airport screening worker who's not old enough to remember when they were in common use.Wait 'till they see my Weber copper-cap rectifier !
My mate Ken was held up for ages bringing a set of THD Yellowjackets over the border to Vancouver for me.He'd picked them up from Andy Marshall of THD and had to call him to explain to customs what they were.They saw them as possible blasting caps. I once carried a 'Smokey' amp, the wee practice amps built into a Marlboro pack.That raised a few eyebrows in airport customs.A cigarette pack with a 9 volt batery.Hmm indeed.
So I got word there's Cyber Twins on board .... and I don't mean the cruise staff girls !! So that means 2x12 Celestion GT12 100 speakers.I've managed with them before.Now to go see this Z28. Thanks all for the dialogue.
Daz
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Post by sudsysul on Apr 10, 2008 10:52:36 GMT -7
You know, I always make the same mistake when I'm talking about headroom, and that is assuming that we all are after the same tone. If someone wants just a smidgeon of fatness and fur on chord work, then there's loads of Z28 headroom. If someone wants crystal clean, it might be another matter, but I would'nt know or even be able to comment 'cause that's not my thing. This model gets called "Dr. Z does Fender," but for my tastes the Z28 doesn't do anything really Fendery (either tweed or modern Deluxe), but rather has it's own sound.
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Post by ericcongdon on Apr 14, 2008 15:05:15 GMT -7
I finally did a gig where I had the room to run my stereo rig, Z28 & Marshall DSL401, cranked, not mic'd thru the PA. Wow what a sound! I recorded the results too and will post some soundclips when I mix it down.
The harshness of the Marshall blended with the Z and it was killer. I def had a wall of sound going. Had both amps on about 5 and NO ONE had a problem hearing me, AND the dums were mic'd!
Ooooohh, I love this amp.
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Post by asattwanger on Apr 14, 2008 15:19:43 GMT -7
That is so cool!!!!
I really want to buy a RxJr so I could run sterio or one clean one dirty, but gonna hold off for a while {if I can} and focusing on where I started. Which is a 2x10 {have} and 1x12 {gonna order this week} for the Z-28. But then I got thinking. I might as well hide the Mesa in the back and run dual rig clean/dirty right now!!!!!
DAVE
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