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Post by saracenz on Oct 30, 2008 16:38:45 GMT -7
I re-tubed my Maz 18 jr. this evening and couldn't help but notice I only had 1 El-84. I have been playing for several weeks at a moderate level, is there any possibility I may have damaged the amp? After re-tubing it sounds fine, in fact it sounded fine with only one power tube. I'm not sure if it was shipped that way, or if a wayward customer may have snagged one while it was on the showroom floor. No matter, I love this amp to pieces.
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Post by nori22 on Oct 30, 2008 19:11:53 GMT -7
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Post by saracenz on Oct 30, 2008 19:19:18 GMT -7
It does sound confusing... what I was trying to say; unbeknownst to me, there was only one power tube in the amp when I bought it. I did not know it till I actually looked at the tubes.
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Post by T-R☼CK ♫ on Oct 30, 2008 20:31:44 GMT -7
Well.......did you put another (1 +1 = 2) in it??....I HOPE it made a difference..
Admittedly, I am ignorant of the Maz tribe, but...based on the advertised wattage, I would ASSUME it was designed with two power tubes in mind.....Just curious... ??
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Post by brad737 on Oct 30, 2008 21:42:00 GMT -7
You may be in luck. It's a common practice with old Marshalls to pull two of the four power tubes. That gives you half the output. (Same thing as a lot of new amps with a half-power switch.) I'm guessing that the Maz Jr. uses two power tubes, so taking one out would give you a 9-watt amp. I simply don't know if it would matter which tube you pulled. I know that Dr. Z uses REALLY stout transformers, so I'd be inclined to think you're ok. Absolutely contact Dr. Z tomorrow and ask. On an aside, Eddie Van Halen was notorious for awhile for only using three 6L6s in his 5150 amps. He really liked the tone...right up until the amp self-destructed. But I wouldn't be worried. He had one side of the amp working with two tubes, the other with only one. All those electrons gotta be symmetrical!
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Post by benttop (Steve) on Oct 30, 2008 22:03:37 GMT -7
I believe I've seen the Doc say not to do that, but usually that's in the context of someone wanting to take out half of the quarted in a higher powered amp. Taking out one whole side of a push pull pair - not sure what that does to things. Need the Doc's input on that one!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2008 7:55:35 GMT -7
It does sound confusing... what I was trying to say; unbeknownst to me, there was only one power tube in the amp when I bought it. I did not know it till I actually looked at the tubes. I was not confused. Just my attempt at humor. Sorry. If the amp is new then contact the dealer and tell them what happened. It seems to me they owe you a set of power tubes. If they don't help contact Brent in "Ask the Experts". As far as hurting it, Z transformers are over built so probably no harm. Doug ;D
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2008 7:57:46 GMT -7
You may be in luck. It's a common practice with old Marshalls to pull two of the four power tubes. That gives you half the output. (Same thing as a lot of new amps with a half-power switch.) I'm guessing that the Maz Jr. uses two power tubes, so taking one out would give you a 9-watt amp. I simply don't know if it would matter which tube you pulled. I know that Dr. Z uses REALLY stout transformers, so I'd be inclined to think you're ok. Absolutely contact Dr. Z tomorrow and ask. On an aside, Eddie Van Halen was notorious for awhile for only using three 6L6s in his 5150 amps. He really liked the tone...right up until the amp self-destructed. But I wouldn't be worried. He had one side of the amp working with two tubes, the other with only one. All those electrons gotta be symmetrical! I am fairly sure the idea of removing power tubes, as you described, is not a good idea in a cathode biased amp like the Maz. ;D
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Post by saracenz on Oct 31, 2008 8:17:03 GMT -7
Again, I did NOT remove the power tube, it was not installed. I did re-tube it *properly* with NOS Mullards. It seems to be working fine, I was only curious if it might have caused damage to the transformer by playing it with only the one power tube.
TIA,
sz
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Post by Lefty on Oct 31, 2008 8:19:21 GMT -7
Again, I did NOT remove the power tube, it was not installed. I did re-tube it *properly* with NOS Mullards. It seems to be working fine, I was only curious if it might have caused damage to the transformer by playing it with only the one power tube. TIA, sz This one would be for Doc to answer for sure.
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Post by saracenz on Oct 31, 2008 10:29:21 GMT -7
Any chance the good dr. might chime inon this forum, or do I need to contact him directly?
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Post by Lefty on Oct 31, 2008 11:48:11 GMT -7
I know he's on here on a regular basis, but you might shoot him an email.
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Post by saracenz on Oct 31, 2008 14:26:05 GMT -7
Well, that's some major bummage lefty, I had trouble enough explaining my situation here on the forum. I can't imagine how much confusion I might create in an actual e-mail.
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Post by brad737 on Oct 31, 2008 14:54:19 GMT -7
I wouldn't bother Doc on a regular basis because I understand how busy he is. But the dealer might have potentially damaged your amp by selling it to you with only one tube. I think an unusual situation like this would warrant a call to the shop just to make sure you didn't damage anything.
Good Luck, Brad
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Post by saracenz on Oct 31, 2008 15:09:31 GMT -7
Brad737, I spoke with the dealer earlier this morning, he assured me they test each and every amp before putting it out on the floor, and if a tube was missing it must have fallen out after the sale. translation; well, no need to go there. I never imagined I would have to count the tubes in an amp before purchasing it.
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Post by benttop (Steve) on Oct 31, 2008 18:03:25 GMT -7
If all seems well enough, I think you're ok. The Z amps do have very stout output transformers, and if there were a problem you would be aware of it because it would affect the sound of your amp. I think you can go forward feeling ok about it. As far as your dealer goes, shame on him for pushing it back on you. If I were a dealer and got that call, I would ask you to bring the amp in right away, then I would check it out and reassure my customer that all is OK. That's his friggin job and he's not doing it. Your best bet, if you still feel you need Dr. Z involved, is to call him during business hours. You'd be surprised how often he picks up the phone there, and he's a very reasonable guy. I'm sure he'll say the same thing, but you might just want to hear it from his mouth. Now go enjoy your amp!
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Post by dongiesen on Oct 31, 2008 18:33:32 GMT -7
Gotta agree with Steve. The dealer should be a positive type goodwill person to his clients for that word of mouth advertising if nothing else
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2008 21:47:50 GMT -7
If all seems well enough, I think you're ok. The Z amps do have very stout output transformers, and if there were a problem you would be aware of it because it would affect the sound of your amp. I think you can go forward feeling ok about it. As far as your dealer goes, shame on him for pushing it back on you. If I were a dealer and got that call, I would ask you to bring the amp in right away, then I would check it out and reassure my customer that all is OK. That's his friggin job and he's not doing it. Your best bet, if you still feel you need Dr. Z involved, is to call him during business hours. You'd be surprised how often he picks up the phone there, and he's a very reasonable guy. I'm sure he'll say the same thing, but you might just want to hear it from his mouth. Now go enjoy your amp! Amen, brutha'
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Post by saracenz on Nov 1, 2008 7:12:24 GMT -7
In defense of the retailer, I'm certain, if I had pressed the matter, he would have bent over backwards to make things right. As it is, I only made a phone call and, his reaction was one of the knee jerk variety.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2008 8:10:55 GMT -7
Very good.
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Post by brad737 on Nov 1, 2008 12:43:43 GMT -7
That sounds like pretty terrible customer service. Depending on their return policy, I'd return it and get one from a dealer who would value you as a customer, not blame you for their screwups.
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Post by John on Nov 3, 2008 20:25:32 GMT -7
I don't see how a Maz Jr could operate with only one powertube.
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Post by benttop (Steve) on Nov 3, 2008 23:06:21 GMT -7
Actually if each side of the push-pull pair are operating near class A, then it seems to me that each side must be reproducing the entire waveform. Just one is pushing while the other is pulling, as it were. Not sure what negatives are involved by not having one tube in though.
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