|
Post by jbgtr on Sept 26, 2008 9:46:11 GMT -7
Hey Myles,
As you informed me of the actual wattage of my Kt45 being ~65 watts and not 45, I was curious if you have tested any of the other Z amps for actual power? Ghia, Ray, Rt 66???
It seems the Doc is very conservative with the power ratings....is he accounting for power before the onset of clipping?
Thank you again for answering my endless inane questions! ;D
|
|
|
Post by stuey222 on Sept 26, 2008 10:06:41 GMT -7
I'm interested in this as well. I would assume Doc rates the before clipping wattages as the official wattages, but we'll wait for Myles...
|
|
|
Post by myles on Sept 29, 2008 11:21:29 GMT -7
Well .... I have tested all of them actually but have the info elsewhere in hand written format. I will have to find that sometime.
I do recall that the Delta 88 though was over 100 watts easily, the SRZ65 was 65+ watts, the RxES, Mazerati and MAZ Sr were all 50-55 watts.
|
|
|
Post by brad737 on Nov 25, 2008 11:10:59 GMT -7
Gents, Amplifiers are rated at the wattage just before clipping occurs. For instance, an old Marshall 1959 Super Lead is rated at 100 watts. But that's 100 watts of CLEAN. That same amp fully cranked, can put out well in excess of 140 or 150 watts! Hearing aids, anyone?
|
|
|
Post by myles on Nov 25, 2008 15:15:46 GMT -7
Gents, Amplifiers are rated at the wattage just before clipping occurs. For instance, an old Marshall 1959 Super Lead is rated at 100 watts. But that's 100 watts of CLEAN. That same amp fully cranked, can put out well in excess of 140 or 150 watts! Hearing aids, anyone? If you play with some of the non-master Marshall 100 watters the ones with over 550 plate volts can put out 170+ watts in some examples.
|
|
|
Post by stuey222 on Nov 25, 2008 19:26:47 GMT -7
So what about speakers? Should we overshoot or are speakers built to accompany the amps?
|
|
|
Post by myles on Nov 26, 2008 10:35:57 GMT -7
So what about speakers? Should we overshoot or are speakers built to accompany the amps? This varies depending on your levels and playing dynamics. In the "old days" a 100 watt Marshall full stack had 8 15 watt silver alnico speakers in the cab. 120 watts capacity ... 60 per cab. Some folks played these rigs all the time. These amps were well over 150 watters if the B+ was above 525 volts which was often the case. Other folks blew speakers on a regular basis.
|
|
|
Post by stuey222 on Nov 26, 2008 23:18:28 GMT -7
So if I'm playing my RXES through a 50w Weber Alnico Blue Dog, or a stock Z-Best, I should be safe, right?
|
|
|
Post by myles on Nov 27, 2008 9:42:14 GMT -7
So if I'm playing my RXES through a 50w Weber Alnico Blue Dog, or a stock Z-Best, I should be safe, right? You should be fine
|
|
|
Post by myles on Dec 1, 2008 10:48:35 GMT -7
Myles, I have one Vox AC30 that puts out 18 watts per 6BQ5, or 72 watts in total. My tech thinks my stangray puts out about 45 watts. What do you think? If your AC30 is stock then your tech is a bit crazy. If you are getting 18 watts out of any EL84 for more than a moment than whoever did this mod is very crazy.
|
|
|
Post by brad737 on Dec 1, 2008 16:31:42 GMT -7
Myles, I have one Vox AC30 that puts out 18 watts per 6BQ5, or 72 watts in total.quote]
|
|
|
Post by myles on Dec 1, 2008 16:37:06 GMT -7
Myles, I have one Vox AC30 that puts out 18 watts per 6BQ5, or 72 watts in total.quote] Again .... pretty insane. Then again .... I think my deluxe reverb says 225 watts on the back .... as in AC watts consumed. Most 100 watters are around 450 watts or so .... But I have seen 4000 watt toasters that could put most any amp to shame on AC input wattage requirement. Bottom line .... a 6BQ5/EL84 is a 12 watt tube and some can be pushed to 14 watts but that is under test settings. In class A two of them are 15-18 watts or so and most AC30 amps are 30-35 watts or so if they are working properly.
|
|
|
Post by myles on Dec 1, 2008 16:38:20 GMT -7
Myles, I have one Vox AC30 that puts out 18 watts per 6BQ5, or 72 watts in total. My tech thinks my stangray puts out about 45 watts. What do you think? Also ... you tech should not "think" an amp puts out a given wattage, he should measure and calculate the wattage. If he is making a lot of guesses on things you may want to find a new tech.
|
|
|
Post by brad737 on Dec 2, 2008 0:05:07 GMT -7
Wow. AC30s are notorious for literally catching on fire. And your's is set up so hot that the tubes glow? And the tubes last for 6 months without burning up? Are you doing anything funky like dropping the voltage with a Variac?
|
|
|
Post by zdogma on Dec 2, 2008 7:22:43 GMT -7
Gents, Amplifiers are rated at the wattage just before clipping occurs. For instance, an old Marshall 1959 Super Lead is rated at 100 watts. But that's 100 watts of CLEAN. That same amp fully cranked, can put out well in excess of 140 or 150 watts! Hearing aids, anyone? I remember the old Hiwatt catalogs would list the 50 watt heads as 50 watts clean RMS and 125 watts peak, the 100 watter were 100 watts RMS, 250 watts peak! mhuss.com/Hiwatt/info/78cat/page01.jpg
|
|
|
Post by Phil (aka Phil) on Dec 2, 2008 8:51:43 GMT -7
Wow. AC30s are notorious for literally catching on fire. And your's is set up so hot that the tubes glow? And the tubes last for 6 months without burning up? Are you doing anything funky like dropping the voltage with a Variac? One thing about the old AC30's (besides inadequate ventilation, IMO) is the use of non-matched EL84's. Those two things add up to a lot of heat generation and build-up. If you run a matched set of output tubes you'll see a lot cooler operation.
|
|
|
Post by myles on Dec 2, 2008 10:10:34 GMT -7
Myles, The 18 watts per 84 is measured and not a guess, and the mod was using a Fender 85 watt Twin Output transformer that I had put in it 25 years ago when the stock item blew. Powertubes last 6 months in this amp, not just a few minutes. They GLOW... it's pretty insane...but it's reality.
As for guessing output from just listening to an amp in a club, that's hardly reason for a new tech...just an educated guess that seems to fall in line with some of what you have stated also.
Ward OK ... then it seems the amp is not stock. A 6L6 OT is a lot different than an EL84 unit, there is going to be a mismatch but if the resulting tone is cool then that is all that matters in the end.
|
|