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Post by Papa Juan (lanier816) on Sept 1, 2015 4:55:26 GMT -7
I've read the term "doping" in multiple conversations about speakers, what does that mean?
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Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Sept 1, 2015 9:18:41 GMT -7
Doping is a process of coating the speaker cone with different things...I've heard everything from lacquer to thinned out silicone rubber or liquid caulk to shellac to model airplane dope to...wood glue! It stiffens the cone and changes the response of the speaker. And that can either be a good thing or a bad thing.
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Post by simpleton on Sept 1, 2015 12:44:55 GMT -7
It can help stop cone cry for those who play with more gain... That's what Weber speakers said when I was just ordering a speaker recently. I have a Blue Dog Ceramic with medium dope that works great with the Therapy.
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Sept 1, 2015 14:36:04 GMT -7
Weber Speaker answers that question here.
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Post by Papa Juan (lanier816) on Sept 1, 2015 14:50:01 GMT -7
Weber Speaker answers that question here. Cool, thanks! I had no idea that existed and had an affect on your tone. It seems like every time I fine tune my tone I discover a new element that can be tweaked and get all Howard Hughesy about my gear, haha!!
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Post by simpleton on Sept 1, 2015 14:54:16 GMT -7
I just got medium dope because I like to play loud with fuzz and octaves and weird sh!t going on...AND I dislike cone cry. Plenty of highs in Z Amps....
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Post by Maddog on Sept 1, 2015 15:03:33 GMT -7
^^^^ All this talk about dope and "Plenty of highs" makes me wanna move......or at least go grab a bag of chips.
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Post by Papa Juan (lanier816) on Sept 3, 2015 4:20:03 GMT -7
One more thing, what's cone cry?
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Post by j4gitr (John) on Sept 3, 2015 5:00:56 GMT -7
^^^^ All this talk about dope and "Plenty of highs" makes me wanna move......or at least go grab a bag of chips. Colorado, Oregon, Washington hang in there it's coming.
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Post by KeithA on Sept 3, 2015 5:06:58 GMT -7
One more thing, what's cone cry? Basically, it's the 'distortion' made when a speaker is forced to exceed it's physical specifications/limitations (not power handing) based on the signal being fed in. For example, a highly doped speaker will limit the amount a excursion a cone will do when fed a signal. However, a lightly doped speaker will be more free to move and can reach its outer limit of excursion more easily and when the speaker cone can't travel any farther than it's attempting to do....the cone flutters (cone cry). That's my take on it anyway
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Post by simpleton on Sept 3, 2015 6:42:53 GMT -7
One more thing, what's cone cry? Basically, it's the 'distortion' made when a speaker is forced to exceed it's physical specifications/limitations (not power handing) based on the signal being fed in. For example, a highly doped speaker will limit the amount a excursion a cone will do when fed a signal. However, a lightly doped speaker will be more free to move and can reach its outer limit of excursion more easily and when the speaker cone can't travel any farther than it's attempting to do....the cone flutters (cone cry). That's my take on it anyway And it can make an odd sound like a goose lives in your tone box...HONK maybe more than cry
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Post by simpleton on Sept 3, 2015 6:47:07 GMT -7
Something else I didn't know is that some speakers are made to perform specifically in a closed back or open back format. At least my understanding is that some speakers prefer open back and a closed back can induce the cone cry syndrome. The cry doesn't happen continuously...it would be occasional...circumstantial even....the Eminence Speaker website list speakers preferred home, whether open or closed or both.
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Post by KeithA on Sept 3, 2015 6:56:40 GMT -7
Something else I didn't know is that some speakers are made to perform specifically in a closed back or open back format. At least my understanding is that some speakers prefer open back and a closed back can induce the cone cry syndrome. The cry doesn't happen continuously...it would be occasional...circumstantial even....the Eminence Speaker website list speakers preferred home, whether open or closed or both. I suspect highly doped speakers work better in a closed back...more back pressure on the cones. The lower doped speakers can 'breathe' more in an open back cab.
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Sept 3, 2015 7:32:11 GMT -7
Remember, too, that the amount of doping will also change the speaker's tone, so you're forced to choose between a "light airy tone" (undoped) versus more stability at high volume (heavily doped).
Actually, the open-back/closed-back distinction is based more on the speaker cone's total damping (combination of physical resistance to movement, plus its mechanical [magnetic] resistance to movement), of which doping is one of many factors. Closed-back cabinets tend to restrain the speaker (keep it under control) a little more, since when the speaker goes out, the resulting low air pressure inside wants to pull it back in. Open-back cabinets, on the other hand, cannot rely on internal air pressure to restrain the speaker.
In general (and in theory), a speaker with lower Qts (total damping factor) would be better-suited in a closed back cab, and a speaker with a higher Qts would be better-suited in an open-back cab or combo. In reality, though, there's so many other factors related to tone that you might as well ignore Qts and do whatever sounds & feels best to you.
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Post by Paul (TRANE) on Sept 3, 2015 10:02:34 GMT -7
I had a set of Weber Alnico Thames undoped. Awesome with my 6545 head.
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Post by Hohn on Oct 9, 2015 6:37:37 GMT -7
Doping is a process of coating the speaker cone with different things...I've heard everything from lacquer to thinned out silicone rubber or liquid caulk to shellac to model airplane dope to...wood glue! It stiffens the cone and changes the response of the speaker. And that can either be a good thing or a bad thing. I believe doping is only applied to the cone edge and surrounding where it meets the frame.
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Post by texan2step on Oct 9, 2015 21:48:31 GMT -7
It's funny this thread is popping up now as I just emailed weber today about the doping. I ordered a 15W Blue Dog in 2006, undoped, and have loved it but now I'm noticing what a I perceive to be cone cry. It doesn't happen all of the time but I've pushed this speaker pretty hard, and it's becoming more and more noticeable. I asked Weber what I could do to prevent that and if I can buy some of the doping material they use. I'll post their recommendation when I hear back from them.
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Post by texan2step on Oct 12, 2015 19:19:21 GMT -7
Heard back from Weber and they were kind enough to offer to dope the speaker for free if I'd pay shopping but they told me a 1:1 mixture of acetone and rubber cement would work fine if I wanted to DIY. I chose not to ship as I felt confident enough.
They said go really light because you can't remove it but you can always add to it. Turned out perfectly! It warmed the highs and made the speaker sound better to my ears and it definitely sounds like a tougher speaker now. Not as brittle sounding as it was before. It took two thin coats and I'm a happy camper without cone cry.
I should add that I was very impressed with Weber's customer service too. I have had some emails go unanswered but now that they've dedicated more people to answering customers, I got a fast response. Really impressed!
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Post by zpilot on Oct 12, 2015 23:42:18 GMT -7
I've had a couple of really good experiences with the people at Weber also.
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