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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Jan 19, 2022 12:21:57 GMT -7
(Boy... sleepy little corner of the forum over here. That's a shame.)
After selling my M12 combo a few years ago--hey, don't judge, we all do things we regret--I've decided to get back into this amp again, this time in a blonde head.
Not sure if I'll be needing to use it with an airbrake but we'll see. I was one of the prominent voices claiming how "not loud" the amp was, so I'll find out with fresh ears this time how correct I was.
Just wanted to share some love for the M12 and kick-start a little action in this board.
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Post by lowbudget on Jan 19, 2022 12:46:20 GMT -7
Congrats!
I don’t need to tell you how happy you’re gonna be.
After trying every manner of 10” speaker imaginable, including the RedFang, I put mine in a head cab and started going through the roster of 12s and 2x10s. Now, it’s right back where it started in a 1x10 with the stock Z 10” speaker and I swear it’s never sounded better. Loud enough to do anything a Ghia will do but can get whisper quiet too, without attenuation. And before anyone questions my sanity about that Ghia comparison, mine cane stock from the factory with a 5AR4. Makes all the difference in the world!
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bigez
New Member
Posts: 46
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Post by bigez on Jan 19, 2022 18:35:10 GMT -7
i’ve been digging my M12 lately. it was on a shelf for a long time, over a year, but i got a new speaker cab and wanted to try it. it really surprised me. it was a lot louder with the new cab (it has a ET90 from WGS in it), and this time i wasn’t afraid to dial the treble way back with my tele, while bringing the volume up really high. it had a very fun crunchy/crispy AC15-like chime that i hadn’t heard in that amp before. mine has the steve miller mod to give it a little more grit. i had this in a combo can in the past, and it had serious ef86 rattle with it. really annoying. maybe that’s why i didn’t play it as loud as i have been lately…? in any case, enjoy!
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Post by 64cousins on Jan 20, 2022 11:07:49 GMT -7
I'm 2 gigs deep with mine, I'm running it almost maxed out on the volume, low-ish on the other 2 knobs. It's really the only set up I've had where I'm using the guitar volume to control the sound. I was playing around with my board today and after about 5 minutes of playing with some OD's I realised the reverb was off and that it didn't actually need it, which for me is unusual.
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Post by GT Roger on Jan 25, 2022 7:42:28 GMT -7
I have the M12 head version. I've been running mine with a Z 1x12 cabinet with a Celestine Alnico cream. I love the M12 together with the Alnico.
It's such a sweet amp!
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Post by simpleton on Jan 25, 2022 17:56:50 GMT -7
This amp always intrigued me…as a Ghia lover, I always wanted to hear the M12 and feel the difference with the cool EQ. Plus a Steve Miller MOD cand take it to 20 watts if a guy needs more power!
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Post by lowbudget on Jan 25, 2022 20:23:39 GMT -7
This amp always intrigued me…as a Ghia lover, I always wanted to hear the M12 and feel the difference with the cool EQ. Plus a Steve Miller MOD cand take it to 20 watts if a guy needs more power! You don’t need the Steve Miller mod to get up to 20 watts. All you need is a quick rectifier swap to a 5ar4. The difference is not subtle!
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Post by detuned on Jan 26, 2022 8:17:55 GMT -7
This amp always intrigued me…as a Ghia lover, I always wanted to hear the M12 and feel the difference with the cool EQ. Plus a Steve Miller MOD cand take it to 20 watts if a guy needs more power! You don’t need the Steve Miller mod to get up to 20 watts. All you need is a quick rectifier swap to a 5ar4. The difference is not subtle! I think the Doc said you should rebias as well. And new output tubes. Can't remember what they are off the top of my head, but there are a couple of threads about the whole procedure. Not a heavy lift, in any event. I use my M12 head with an Avatar 1X12 loaded with a Scumback H55 or a Z 1X10, I modded and stuffed a 12" Scumback s75-PVC (Alnico) speaker into. Sounds killer with either. I usually pair it with either a Swart AST or a '65 Fender Band-Master someone (not me) converted into a combo (depending on the room). It seems the less I play live, the more elaborate my set up becomes... Good to have you back in the club!
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Post by lowbudget on Jan 26, 2022 8:50:36 GMT -7
You don’t need the Steve Miller mod to get up to 20 watts. All you need is a quick rectifier swap to a 5ar4. The difference is not subtle! I think the Doc said you should rebias as well. And new output tubes. Can't remember what they are off the top of my head, but there are a couple of threads about the whole procedure. Not a heavy lift, in any event. I use my M12 head with an Avatar 1X12 loaded with a Scumback H55 or a Z 1X10, I modded and stuffed a 12" Scumback s75-PVC (Alnico) speaker into. Sounds killer with either. I usually pair it with either a Swart AST or a '65 Fender Band-Master someone (not me) converted into a combo (depending on the room). It seems the less I play live, the more elaborate my set up becomes... Good to have you back in the club! I bet I read that thread a hundred times because at first the rebias thing was unclear. Turns out you only need to rebias if you’re doing the entire Steve Miller mod, to include going to the 844s. If you’re just installing the 5AR4 no rebias is needed. It was so sketchy I called the doc to be sure. My M12 was one of the very last ones made and it came factory stock with a 5AR4 and is loud AF. When I asked doc if I really had an M20 he gave that little sly chuckle of his and said “Well, an M18 anyway.” A search for “5ar4” in the M12 section will reveal that I wasn’t the only one unclear but that you don’t need to rebias if you just change out the recto. The difference it makes is really transformative IMO.
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Post by jhen86 (jordan) on Jan 26, 2022 18:26:06 GMT -7
The bias resistor in the Miller mod just biases the EL84s even hotter. Sorry that’s probably obvious to many. But just wanted to clarify that it’s not magic, just cooks your tubes a bit more. I’ve measured voltages with all the standard rectifiers in my stock M12. A 5AR4 puts just over 350V on the plates of my EL84’s. Which put my plate dissipation right at 100% of the rated 12W limit. Maybe a touch over actually. The Miller mod resistor swap would only push things further beyond the rated limit. Which is cool, and not uncommon for EL84’s. Just burn through tubes faster.
So all that to say, I’d guess you get about 18W with just a 5AR4 and stock setup. And 20W with the hotter bias resistor in the Miller mod, using standard EL84’s.
The M12 is plenty loud with the stock 180 ohm bias resistor and a 5AR4, to my ear.
Said another way, wattage is just current X voltage. The bias resistor increases the current the tubes pull, the rectifier increases the voltage they run at. You can choose to do one, both, or neither. Wattage will just reflect the those two variables.
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Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Jan 27, 2022 6:44:26 GMT -7
(Boy... sleepy little corner of the forum over here. That's a shame.)After selling my M12 combo a few years ago--hey, don't judge, we all do things we regret--I've decided to get back into this amp again, this time in a blonde head. Not sure if I'll be needing to use it with an airbrake but we'll see. I was one of the prominent voices claiming how "not loud" the amp was, so I'll find out with fresh ears this time how correct I was. Just wanted to share some love for the M12 and kick-start a little action in this board. I'm looking forward to your review of your incoming M12, Mark...I've always wondered about Doc's EF-86 front ended amps, but I haven't ever tried one.
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Post by detuned on Jan 28, 2022 8:35:25 GMT -7
This is one of the many reasons I love this pace: so helpful!
Looks like I'm in the market for a new rectifier tube. I don't "need" it, but now I want to hear what it sounds like. Thanks!
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Post by jhen86 (jordan) on Jan 28, 2022 8:39:29 GMT -7
This is one of the many reasons I love this pace: so helpful! Looks like I'm in the market for a new rectifier tube. I don't "need" it, but now I want to hear what it sounds like. Thanks! A huge part of the equation in this conversation is having a top shelf handwired amp that you can experiment with. Not typically the case with a mass produced big brand pcb amp. The quality amps doc produces and thoughtful design allows for it.
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