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Post by Paul G on Apr 16, 2021 21:42:27 GMT -7
The tube layout is the same and I'm just wondering how close the two match up?
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Post by justjoshinya on Apr 18, 2021 9:49:10 GMT -7
Kinda... I was lucky enough to own a 1967 Princeton for a while, and it was magical until one fateful catastrophic failure. I got it fixed but it was never quite the same, probably just in my head? With all of that said no other amp has responded like that original 67, until the Z-Plus! The reverb on the Z is the best I’ve ever played, the tone is much more sculpt-able the Princeton’s, The Z has a lot more ability to be the volume I need between the master volume and half power I have never had the problem of being too loud or not loud enough in churches that seat 25-300. If I need louder clean I can get it, if I need edge of breakup at comfortable levels it’s there if I want bedroom level I can have it! So to sum it up they do share the same DNA but unless your playing a GREAT blackface Princeton and possibly even if you are, you will be amazed by the Z Plus! I can’t recommend the Z-Plus/Cream Back combo enough!
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Post by Paul G on Apr 18, 2021 21:37:53 GMT -7
Kinda... I was lucky enough to own a 1967 Princeton for a while, and it was magical until one fateful catastrophic failure. I got it fixed but it was never quite the same, probably just in my head? With all of that said no other amp has responded like that original 67, until the Z-Plus! The reverb on the Z is the best I’ve ever played, the tone is much more sculpt-able the Princeton’s, The Z has a lot more ability to be the volume I need between the master volume and half power I have never had the problem of being too loud or not loud enough in churches that seat 25-300. If I need louder clean I can get it, if I need edge of breakup at comfortable levels it’s there if I want bedroom level I can have it! So to sum it up they do share the same DNA but unless your playing a GREAT blackface Princeton and possibly even if you are, you will be amazed by the Z Plus! I can’t recommend the Z-Plus/Cream Back combo enough! Thank you for the in depth write-up. This is all good info and pretty much what I was looking for. Appreciate it greatly!
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Post by daddyelmis (Greg) on Apr 19, 2021 4:45:53 GMT -7
My understanding is that the ZPlus is more Champ than Princeton. The ZPlus is true Class A, like the Champ, where the Princeton is AB. The twin 6v6 of the ZPlus was Doc’s magical way of getting stage volume out of the single ended design. That said, I’ve not seen a side-by-side comparison of the 3 amps. I just know the ZPlus is one of the best sounding amps I’ve ever played.
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Post by pcns on Apr 19, 2021 5:55:33 GMT -7
sigh . . . . why do I read these posts . . . . my dad had a Princton while I was growing up, it really did sound great . . . now I want a Zplus realy bad.
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Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Apr 19, 2021 11:37:29 GMT -7
sigh . . . . why do I read these posts . . . . my dad had a Princton while I was growing up, it really did sound great . . . now I want a Zplus realy bad. You can try mine out on Saturday when you and Josh come by...
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Post by pcns on Apr 19, 2021 13:43:46 GMT -7
sigh . . . . why do I read these posts . . . . my dad had a Princton while I was growing up, it really did sound great . . . now I want a Zplus realy bad. You can try mine out on Saturday when you and Josh come by... I'm not sure that will help! ha ha but will gladly plug in
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Post by justjoshinya on Apr 19, 2021 17:54:25 GMT -7
My understanding is that the ZPlus is more Champ than Princeton. The ZPlus is true Class A, like the Champ, where the Princeton is AB. The twin 6v6 of the ZPlus was Doc’s magical way of getting stage volume out of the single ended design. That said, I’ve not seen a side-by-side comparison of the 3 amps. I just know the ZPlus is one of the best sounding amps I’ve ever played. I’ve never played an older champ did have a Goodsell Champton once and it was a great practice amp but it was no Z-Plus. Maybe I need to try an original blackface champ? The only thing I could think of that could make the Z Plus any better would be to have the tremolo out of that 67 Princeton in it.
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Post by djhblue on Apr 27, 2021 14:45:14 GMT -7
I have a few amps-Z-Plus LT w/Celstion Blue, Fender '68 Custom Princeton wi/ 10in Celestion Alnico Gold, Fender '68 Custom DR, and a black faced 72 Vibrolux Reverb w/vintage Jensen gold back 10's. They all have their voice as expected. The Princeton is just a beautiful little amp, plenty loud for any club gig. But in comparing the the Z? I The Z is more harmonic, also the cabinet adds to its flavor. Wider, deeper, gives more of a richer sound. Wish it had tremolo, but the $39 Dan Electro Filthy Rich does the trick for me. And stage presence? The Z wins hands down.
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Post by vanceen on Apr 27, 2021 17:18:53 GMT -7
The Z Plus is really very different from a Princeton technically. In essence, it's a double Champ, i.e. it's a single ended Champ circuit but with two 6V6's in parallel instead of just one. (Of course, the Z Plus has other features like a tone stack, a cut control, and reverb, but that's kind of added on).
The cool thing about a single ended amp is that second order harmonics are strong, so it sounds really sweet and musical. A push-pull amp like the Princeton and almost any other amp with more than one tube cancels out the second order harmonics generated in the power tubes.
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Post by lowbudget on Apr 27, 2021 18:16:47 GMT -7
The Z Plus is really very different from a Princeton technically. In essence, it's a double Champ, i.e. it's a single ended Champ circuit but with two 6V6's in parallel instead of just one. (Of course, the Z Plus has other features like a tone stack, a cut control, and reverb, but that's kind of added on). The cool thing about a single ended amp is that second order harmonics are strong, so it sounds really sweet and musical. A push-pull amp like the Princeton and almost any other amp with more than one tube cancels out the second order harmonics generated in the power tubes. I realize that the circuits, tubes, etc. are completely different but from a purely functional standpoint I think a 1x10 M12 comes mighty close. Except of course with the right speaker it’s literally on steroids compared to the Princeton. Throw a Flint in front of it and it’s beautiful beyond description. Even if you don’t use much trem, you can leave it engaged but dialed down really low and it will thicken the tone really nicely. I’ll admit to being a fanboy but it’s one Z that I thought just never got a fair shake.
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Post by tumeniamps (Tom) on Apr 28, 2021 4:40:26 GMT -7
Let me put it this way. My original 1965 Princeton Reverb was one of my main gigging amps for almost 20 years. When I got my Z-Plus and put them side by side, I sold my PR the following week. The Z-Plus is really something special.
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Post by justjoshinya on Apr 28, 2021 6:15:52 GMT -7
Let me put it this way. My original 1965 Princeton Reverb was one of my main gigging amps for almost 20 years. When I got my Z-Plus and put them side by side, I sold my PR the following week. The Z-Plus is really something special. Same here and my 67 PR sounded great!
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Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Apr 28, 2021 8:36:48 GMT -7
For me to say that my Z-Plus is something special is for me to make an understatement! It's got a tone all its own and sounds so cool, clean or driven. It's got this clarity that can't be described, just very open and full.
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