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Post by Russell B on Apr 15, 2021 5:01:27 GMT -7
I've been looking for a very nice Strat style guitar for a while now. I've looked a Custom Shop Fenders, Andersons, Suhrs, EBMM's, and others. My question to you is this: Should I stay traditional and go with a SSS type or go more modern and go with a humbucker in the bridge? It just seems that the "vintage styled Super Strat" is common now (Suhr's, Andersons, and EBMM's).
Thanks.
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Post by Ridgeback on Apr 15, 2021 5:41:18 GMT -7
I'd go SSS from a purely cosmetic standpoint. There are a wide variety of strat sized pups out there from traditional to P-90 to HB construction\voicing so you won't be limiting your tonal options much and I think S-type guitars look best without a full sized HB in the bridge. Don't forget about Grosh when looking at options. My 2 cents.
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Post by pcns on Apr 15, 2021 5:47:43 GMT -7
I also like the look of the SSS strats and there are lots of mini humbucker sized pups available to get that humbucker vibe going.
Grosh make great guitars, I've enjoyed the Nash or 2 that I have played. G&L makes excellent guitars too . . . . many choices, play a few and see what you fall in love with.
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Apr 15, 2021 6:30:41 GMT -7
HSS strat-style guitars are a huge fad right now. I'm not saying they don't have their rightful, specific place in the market, but the 80s/90s guitars have been leaping off the shelves in the last year. (I have no idea why; this started before EVH passed away.)
I have both a "true" Fender Strat and a Suhr HSS. They're both excellent, and I suppose you could say that the Suhr is more versatile. Maybe. But combining single-coils with humbuckers (or even just a coil-split humbucker) in one guitar almost always seems to have drawbacks or consequences to it:
The humbuckers will be significantly louder than the single-coils, throwing off your setup/settings as you switch positions. There's really no way around this... it just "is."
Often (but not always) your output impedance--meaning, the value of your guitar's volume potentiometer--will be compromised in some way. I mean, you generally want 250k pots for single coils, and 500k pots for humbuckers; so, what to do with a guitar that's mixed or has coil-splitting humbuckers? The only guitars I know that avoid this are the Suhrs (like mine) with their super-switch that modifies the impedance for the positions that bring in the humbucker; and PRS's wildly-advanced (and expensive!) Modern Eagle V, which allows you to select 250 vs 500 on a switch. But regardless of this... you're still gonna have that volume difference above...
I think you might have a sense of my overall thoughts here. SSS = tried & true; not many compromises once you can finally accept how to use a single-coil in the bridge position. HSS = seemingly the perfect solution, but it's far from perfect.
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Post by Jaguarguy (Mike) on Apr 15, 2021 6:39:36 GMT -7
I third the SSS set up. I'd look at the Fender Eric Johnson - right up there with the CS strats for a whole lot less money. Used $1,500-$1,700 new $1,999. BTW - in the Peach video it appears he is using the Maz 38 as his amp of choice.
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Post by GuitarZ on Apr 15, 2021 8:03:51 GMT -7
Have you played them or owned them before? If not, I'd say go out and get your hands on what you can to kick the tires.
I had it in my mind I was getting a Tele for my 40th birthday. I played a few and they were okay. However, the sales guy had to go to the warehouse to get one particular model. While waiting, I saw a strat sitting there, picked it up, plugged it in, and went "Wow. That is a strat sound, and it sounds good." Thus, my 40th birthday present was a nice strat. Wow. It just hit me that time does go by in that I've now had that strat for 19 years. Yikes!
Good Luck & have Fun!
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Post by nicholas on Apr 15, 2021 11:42:39 GMT -7
All I can offer is I've always wanted to like a strat. I've bought nice ones. They don't stick around long. So good luck!
In hind sight I should have just grabbed a standard USA strat first to see if I still liked it after a few months rather than jumping "all in". Live and learn I guess.
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Post by Seńor Verde on Apr 15, 2021 11:56:54 GMT -7
I'm primarily a humbucker player, so I like my Strats SSS. Not necessarily the most traditional Strat pickups sometimes, but no traditional humbuckers in my Strats.
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Post by ME on Apr 15, 2021 12:10:30 GMT -7
Yeah, a Strat has 3 single cool pickups. True Strat tone, IMO, needs them to NOT have a reverse wound middle pu. I have that and while the hum is reduced the sound isn’t the same as a non reverse middle. Now, if you’re looking for a guitar with Strat shaped body, you can choose whatever pu’s you’d like. Maybe 3 soapbars. ME
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Post by adam on Apr 15, 2021 16:43:16 GMT -7
I like SSS. Any HSS I've had leaves me flat. Best setup for me is one tone control on the bridge pickup and generally roll that down to 5. It's a neat sound, not a lot of bottom, and the highs don't kill you with tone rolled off. It's really hard to balance that humbucker with the single coils and never sounds right to me. You kind of lose 40% of what a strat is supposed to sound like, IMO. My 2 cents anyway.
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Post by southmusic70 on Apr 15, 2021 17:48:09 GMT -7
Look at G&L
There are some options for you
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Post by Norrin Radd on Apr 16, 2021 6:05:31 GMT -7
The humbuckers will be significantly louder than the single-coils, throwing off your setup/settings as you switch positions. There's really no way around this... it just "is." I think I have to pick a fight with you here Mark. This all comes down to set up in my opinion. I have both an SSS Strat and an HSS Strat. I don’t have any volume issues between the pick ups. All one needs to is properly set the pickup height of the Humbucker in the bridge to match the volume output of the other two pick ups. That just doesn’t seem that hard to me. Now to be fair, I don’t do any splitting of that humbucker. I have that guitar wired exactly the same way as an SSS Strat would be wired. No volume difference. In case you’re wondering, that humbucker is an old Di’Marzio PAF pro.
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Post by GT Roger on Apr 16, 2021 6:44:39 GMT -7
I would suggest getting a Strat style guitar with the bath tub routing under the pickgaurd.
I recently got a G&L Legacy HSS. I always wanted to try a HSS after playing a Fender SRV SSS for many years.
I've struggled with the tone of the guitar so far. I thought I'd love the sound of the humbucker and middle pickup together, but it's less than stellar for my rig.
It might be the pickups or pots. Anyway, It's my new project guitar. It has the bath tub rout, so there's plenty of options.
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Apr 16, 2021 9:09:03 GMT -7
I think I have to pick a fight with you here Mark. This all comes down to set up in my opinion. I have both an SSS Strat and an HSS Strat. I don’t have any volume issues between the pick ups. All one needs to is properly set the pickup height of the Humbucker in the bridge to match the volume output of the other two pick ups. That just doesn’t seem that hard to me. Now to be fair, I don’t do any splitting of that humbucker. I have that guitar wired exactly the same way as an SSS Strat would be wired. No volume difference. In case you’re wondering, that humbucker is an old Di’Marzio PAF pro. My experience with this was two Suhrs from recent years--a T-style with HB in the neck, and an S-style with HB in the bridge: The T-style had an SSV in the neck, which is supposed to be "vintage-style" output, but I found it to be extremely loud in this guitar. (The bridge pickup is kind of a one-small-step-hotter-than-vintage tele pickup, but no amount of adjustment was going to rectify a loud neck pu vs. any single-coil bridge.) I replaced it with an even-lower-output Thornbucker, which was good because that's a stellar pickup anyway, and it's pretty low output. Much better now. And yes, as you suggested--a LOT of tedious adjustment of pickup heights (and being mindful of guitar volume position) has helped a ton. My HSS strat is the one that will jump from 250k-->500k output if I switch, say, from neck SC to bridge HB. Now, the pickups themselves sound "correct" in each position (each pickup has the "right" output impedance pot in those positions) but it's still basically pushing a hotter signal out of the guitar at that point. So, it's been a struggle balancing those. Yes again, adjusting pickup heights work... but it's not helping that on that guitar I also replaced the SC's with their low-output V60LP's instead of the hotter stock V70's. Much better across the board if you can accept high-output SC's and low-output HB's for sure when you're combining them into one guitar.
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Post by Norrin Radd on Apr 16, 2021 10:33:22 GMT -7
I think I have to pick a fight with you here Mark. This all comes down to set up in my opinion. I have both an SSS Strat and an HSS Strat. I don’t have any volume issues between the pick ups. All one needs to is properly set the pickup height of the Humbucker in the bridge to match the volume output of the other two pick ups. That just doesn’t seem that hard to me. Now to be fair, I don’t do any splitting of that humbucker. I have that guitar wired exactly the same way as an SSS Strat would be wired. No volume difference. In case you’re wondering, that humbucker is an old Di’Marzio PAF pro. My experience with this was two Suhrs from recent years--a T-style with HB in the neck, and an S-style with HB in the bridge: The T-style had an SSV in the neck, which is supposed to be "vintage-style" output, but I found it to be extremely loud in this guitar. (The bridge pickup is kind of a one-small-step-hotter-than-vintage tele pickup, but no amount of adjustment was going to rectify a loud neck pu vs. any single-coil bridge.) I replaced it with an even-lower-output Thornbucker, which was good because that's a stellar pickup anyway, and it's pretty low output. Much better now. And yes, as you suggested--a LOT of tedious adjustment of pickup heights (and being mindful of guitar volume position) has helped a ton. My HSS strat is the one that will jump from 250k-->500k output if I switch, say, from neck SC to bridge HB. Now, the pickups themselves sound "correct" in each position (each pickup has the "right" output impedance pot in those positions) but it's still basically pushing a hotter signal out of the guitar at that point. So, it's been a struggle balancing those. Yes again, adjusting pickup heights work... but it's not helping that on that guitar I also replaced the SC's with their low-output V60LP's instead of the hotter stock V70's. Much better across the board if you can accept high-output SC's and low-output HB's for sure when you're combining them into one guitar. Yeah - that makes a lot of sense. It probably helps in my case that the PAF Pro is about 30+ years old and was a weak output humbucker to begin with! I paired it up with a couple of Di’Marzio area 67‘s so that I could have a completely silent HSS guitar. They all seem to work together very very well. But I guess you are correct – everybody’s experience is going to depend greatly on the specific pickups they decide to use.
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Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Apr 16, 2021 17:44:14 GMT -7
I tried a HSS Suhr down at Motor City Guitars about 8 years ago. I wish, wish wish I had bought that guitar. I went back a couple of years later to buy one, and I tried several of the same model that I had loved a few years ago. None of them were good (for me). Each was different in one way or another; it's been my experience that Strats more than any other guitar are different from one to the next. I was really bummed...I've kicked myself for not buying that "one" guitar for years. I've been looking for a nice Strat for years, and one fell into my hands at a GC store here in my home town. It's a fantastic Strat, a Custom Shop model. I really like it. But I'll never forget that Suhr that I almost bought. It was great in all switch positions, the setup was just right.
My best advice is to try a whole bunch of them. Wring them out and see if you can find the "One" that speaks to you.
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Post by Russell B on Apr 21, 2021 3:35:16 GMT -7
Thank you all for helping me out.
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Post by Norrin Radd on Apr 21, 2021 7:32:10 GMT -7
Thank you all for helping me out. How did we do that!
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Post by daddyelmis (Greg) on Apr 21, 2021 10:15:39 GMT -7
I’ve used the EMG Gilmour pups for years now on one of my strats, and it really works to maintain the SSS sound and “quack” of the Strat, while letting me dial up the SPC control to get a very ‘bucker-esque tone without a humbucker, especially on the bridge pup.
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Post by Jefferson on Apr 21, 2021 14:17:29 GMT -7
The best Strat bridge pickup I’ve ever used was a Fralin SP43. That paired with their vintage hots in the neck and middle was magical. Perfectly balanced. The Strat tone but with heft and thickness...
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Post by zpilot on Apr 22, 2021 23:15:16 GMT -7
What are you wanting from a Strat? If you are going to be playing with switch positions 2 & 4 and wanting the signature Strat quack then you will want SSS. If you are going to play primarily on the bridge pick-up and want it hot then I'd say go for a humbucker there or maybe a hot single coil. I'm kind of partial to the Seymour Duncan Little '59 for that application. The cool thing about it is that it requires no mod to the stock pickguard or body. So if you decide it is not your cup of tea you can always go back to the normal single-coil.
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Post by Russell B on Apr 23, 2021 4:09:19 GMT -7
What are you wanting from a Strat? If you are going to be playing with switch positions 2 & 4 and wanting the signature Strat quack then you will want SSS. If you are going to play primarily on the bridge pick-up and want it hot then I'd say go for a humbucker there or maybe a hot single coil. I'm kind of partial to the Seymour Duncan Little '59 for that application. The cool thing about it is that it requires no mod to the stock pickguard or body. So if you decide it is not your cup of tea you can always go back to the normal single-coil. I’m pretty sure I want a traditional SSS strat. Some times, I need that single coil sound on the bridge pickup. I have a Little ‘59 and like it a lot.
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Post by John on Apr 24, 2021 13:17:23 GMT -7
The humbuckers will be significantly louder than the single-coils, throwing off your setup/settings as you switch positions. There's really no way around this... it just "is."
I'm late to the game here. I've had a strat since 1984. (same one) At one point a put a humbuckers in it. (one of those strat sized humbuckers) And as soon as I did, I missed the single coil bridge pickup. Took the humbucker out, and it's been sitting in a drawer for 15 years.
And as Mark said, humbuckers are higher output throwing off settings but also throwing off the tone of the all important 4th position.
And my pickups were stock, I've never felt the need to change them.
The gamechanger for me was having a tech change the 2nd tone control. Instead of being only for the middle pickup...it's now for the middle and the bridge. (works on positions 3-4-5) It allowed me to take the treble bite off the bridge pickup. VERY useful!!
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Post by Russell B on Apr 24, 2021 15:24:49 GMT -7
The humbuckers will be significantly louder than the single-coils, throwing off your setup/settings as you switch positions. There's really no way around this... it just "is."
I'm late to the game here. I've had a strat since 1984. (same one) At one point a put a humbuckers in it. (one of those strat sized humbuckers) And as soon as I did, I missed the single coil bridge pickup. Took the humbucker out, and it's been sitting in a drawer for 15 years.
And as Mark said, humbuckers are higher output throwing off settings but also throwing off the tone of the all important 4th position.
And my pickups were stock, I've never felt the need to change them.
The gamechanger for me was having a tech change the 2nd tone control. Instead of being only for the middle pickup...it's now for the middle and the bridge. (works on positions 3-4-5) It allowed me to take the treble bite off the bridge pickup. VERY useful!!
The tone control change would definitely be something I would want.
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Post by spencer096 on May 5, 2021 9:32:05 GMT -7
bought an eric johnson strat the very first year they came out...got it signed by my hero allan holdsworth when he did a clinic at north texas...imo they're the best strat you can buy, custom shop, boutique, partscaster, period.
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Post by spencer096 on May 5, 2021 9:32:39 GMT -7
I'm late to the game here. I've had a strat since 1984. (same one) At one point a put a humbuckers in it. (one of those strat sized humbuckers) And as soon as I did, I missed the single coil bridge pickup. Took the humbucker out, and it's been sitting in a drawer for 15 years.
And as Mark said, humbuckers are higher output throwing off settings but also throwing off the tone of the all important 4th position.
And my pickups were stock, I've never felt the need to change them.
The gamechanger for me was having a tech change the 2nd tone control. Instead of being only for the middle pickup...it's now for the middle and the bridge. (works on positions 3-4-5) It allowed me to take the treble bite off the bridge pickup. VERY useful!!
The tone control change would definitely be something I would want. EJ strat comes with the 2nd tone wired to bridge. incredibly useful.
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on May 5, 2021 9:57:50 GMT -7
The tone control change would definitely be something I would want. EJ strat comes with the 2nd tone wired to bridge. incredibly useful. Yeah... it's 2021 and this ought to be the standard Strat setup by now--I can't believe that it isn't. Much more useful to have neck & middle on one tone control, and bridge on another. I've done my own Strat this way, and also like Spencer says the EJ one does too. Also, my Suhr HSS came that way too (neck & middle s/c's on the first Tone, bridge hb on the other) probably because it's obvious in that HSS setup. Edit: actually, my Strat tone knobs are separated as Neck on one, and Middle & Bridge on the other. And I think that's actually what the EJ does too. But my Suhr HSS separates the Neck & Middle (again, the single coils) to one, and the Bridge (HB) to another. Bottom line... give the bridge pickup a tone control for goodness sake!
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Post by El Gato Blackie on May 5, 2021 19:54:36 GMT -7
I’ve used the EMG Gilmour pups for years now on one of my strats, and it really works to maintain the SSS sound and “quack” of the Strat, while letting me dial up the SPC control to get a very ‘bucker-esque tone without a humbucker, especially on the bridge pup. I have this set up too. I have very few guitars so I like them to be versatile and this gets me a lot of tones especially when I add a gain.
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Post by detuned on May 6, 2021 5:30:56 GMT -7
If you're worried you won't be able to get a saturated lead tone with a single coil bridge, worry not. That's easily achieved with a little work and the right gear. If you're worried you won't get that twangy bridge sound with a humbucker, then you should probably stick with the single - humbuckers (generally speaking) don't do that as well. If you want a fatter sound in the bridge, you may want a humbucker.
If it's at all possible, try to find some Grosh S-styles. He does both configs and they both sound amazing. Without trying it out, it's hard to know what's right for you.
Also consider LsL in your search - ah-mazing.
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Post by gbowman on May 17, 2021 11:29:26 GMT -7
I have tried every possible setup with my Strat, including humbucker sized P90s, single coil sized humbuckers etc etc. I have come back to all single coils. The key has been wiring the tone controls so #1 is attached to the neck PU and tone #2 is attached to the bridge. I use a .022 on the bridge and a .015 for the neck. I use my Strat and a Heritage 535 for pretty much everything. Also, its not a boutique strat. I did change the neck to rosewood with a larger radius, but that's it.
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