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Post by helmi on Aug 5, 2019 13:25:43 GMT -7
Do you guys notice any difference, to the naked ear, of a speaker cab wired in series or parallel? I dont mean in ohmage, like using the full transformer windings at 16 ohms, compared to 8 or 4, but just from series to paralle wiringl. example, if you had 2 -4 ohm speakers in series adding up to 8, or 2 -16 ohm speakers in parallel dividing to 8, do you think there is a sound difference?
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Aug 5, 2019 13:37:09 GMT -7
I would love to hear Doc's take on this. From an electrical perspective, this shouldn't make much difference as I'd think the speaker "sees" exactly the same signal and therefore it shouldn't matter. However, Doc specifically wired the speakers in a certain way in the original Z-wreck cabs (series with the Blue on the " + " side, I believe) so there must've been a reason for doing so.
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Post by headshrinker (Marc) on Aug 5, 2019 14:28:38 GMT -7
I don't, but I don't have the dog ears some folks seem to.
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Post by "Z" Steve on Aug 5, 2019 15:06:37 GMT -7
Ask Eric Johnson.
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Post by jhen86 (jordan) on Aug 6, 2019 6:00:58 GMT -7
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Post by jhen86 (jordan) on Aug 6, 2019 19:49:13 GMT -7
Obviously there are differences, but how to describe or identify those accurately gets a little trickier. If you google series parallel vs parallel series there are some other forum that seem to think that one wiring emphasizes highs/presence a little more than another. Can’t remember which. The differences are subtle is what I have read. Best way to know for sure is first hand. Carve out two hours to try wiring your cab each way. If you have the means record it too, even better. I’d happily do it myself too. I’m OCD like that. I just don’t have a 4x12 to try it on. Would love to know your thoughts!
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Post by jhen86 (jordan) on Aug 8, 2019 16:34:22 GMT -7
I may be crazy, but in my personal examples of trying stuff at different ohms, I sort of feel like the lower the ohm tap on the amp, the more power it has to to it, in some way. Like the fundamental is stronger or something. 16 ohms seems to have more emphasis on the top and some extra sizzle/grit up there.
That could be total bogus though, and just what my brain wants to hear, because I mentally associate 4 ohms more with Fender amps, and 16 ohms with Vox/Marshall.
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Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Aug 8, 2019 18:33:26 GMT -7
Ideal power transfer happens at 4 ohms and 8 and 16 ohms, it doesn't matter as far as power transfer is concerned; the key is you have to match the output impedance of the transformer to the impedance of the load for maximum power and efficiency. But the sound is going to be slightly different. Here's what they taught me in engineering school when we studied transformer design: It really boils down to the relationship between the output tubes, the output transformer, and the difference that you get with series speakers (higher inductance, lower impedance) and parallel speakers (lower inductance, higher impedance. The interaction between the three elements of speaker load, transformer transfer characteristics, and tube plate load, all resolve in a complex load relationship that has subtle differences in some systems, and fairly striking differences in others, depending on factors like speaker resonant frequency at different points on a load line. That's a long winded way to say that each amp is different and each speaker system is too. Trial and error is going to be your best friend here.
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Post by pcns on Aug 8, 2019 19:53:09 GMT -7
For me, depending on the set up I can hear slight difference between 16 and 4 ohm. I cant usually hear a difference between series and parallel (other than anything attributed to impedance) I can feel a difference between the two. Series will feel a little mushier to me where parallel feels tighter. Its similar to the feel difference between the solid state and tube rectifier switch on the back of my EMS. If anyone wants to play around with series vs parallel I would be happy to mail out one of my Happy Cab boxes that could be passed around. email me at todd@procablesnsound.com and I'll start a list up. my 2 cents, Todd
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Post by sharkboy on Aug 9, 2019 5:58:43 GMT -7
As suggested above, the transformer equalizes the load that the output tubes see. If you look at a data sheet for a tube, there will be a nominal circuit power rating for different voltages and loads. Normally, to the amp, if correctly hooked up, there should be no difference between them.
That said, I have found detectable differences in same model speakers at different load ratings (I don’t like referring to these as impedances.) These differences may just be variations between speakers that could also be present in different speakers at the same loads, but each smaller speaker load increment goes through more windings at the output transformer- which can affect the sound, as well.
Then, if I remember correctly, 2 speakers are likely to be perceived as 3db louder at the same power level as one if correctly compared to a single speaker.
I don’t hear a lot of difference between a 2x12 guitar cabinet hooked up serially from parallel- even through 4x transformer windings to the parallel config. I prefer to use serial configurations, since that tends to protect speakers a bit better (but the lowest speaker power rating is still extremely relevant.) Someone with better/younger ears than mine should have more accurate information than I about how this sounds to them.
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