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Post by John E. on Nov 19, 2018 10:45:14 GMT -7
So, I'm wanting/needing to pick up a new guitar for our upcoming circuit of shows cause I don't have a backup. Realistically I only have 2 guitars that I can use and one of them has to stay in Open C. So I need to find either a backup for my #1 or a "replacement" and my current #1 would be the backup since I obliterated the headstock a while back and I don't trust the fix to hold up on a tour, especially since we have a small tour in Costa Rica in 2020 where I'd only take 1 guitar.
I'm REALLY leaning towards a Gibson CS RI. But I'm stuck between the 4 models. R7, R8, R9, R0. Vote which one YOU prefer out of the four and WHY. Or give me some examples of how each one is different.
My current #1 is a Les Paul traditional that I've modded to the point where the only original parts of the guitar is the wood of the body and neck. Even some of that has been replaced LOL.
The open C guitar is a '64 RI ES-345 that I use for slide and heavier songs.
So with Black Friday coming up I know there will be some good deals on some nice guitars, like I know Normans Rare Guitars is doing 10% off all guitars and Austin Vintage is having a sale as well. So I figured what better way to buy a high end guitar than with a discount! Plus the reason I wanna buy a higher end guitar vs modding one like I did is cause after doing all the mods I'd wanna do, the total cost of the guitar plus the mods would barely be less than a used R8 or 70's LP Custom.
And it doesn't HAVE to be for this Black Friday, it could just be a goal to save up my money for.
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Post by The Bad Poodle Experience on Nov 19, 2018 10:54:41 GMT -7
Those are probably all Humbucker guitars. I believe the R6's have P-90's. there will be a major difference in the neck size. R9 and R0 will have a slim taper neck. R7 and R8's are baseball bats. R7 will be a goldtop and the R8, 9 and 0 would be bursts.
I own and play an R8 but if i had some cash, i'd be looking at the 59's due to the slimmer neck.
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Post by John E. on Nov 19, 2018 10:58:37 GMT -7
Those are probably all Humbucker guitars. I believe the R6's have P-90's. there will be a major difference in the neck size. R9 and R0 will have a slim taper neck. R7 and R8's are baseball bats. R7 will be a goldtop and the R8, 9 and 0 would be bursts.
I own and play an R8 but if i had some cash, i'd be looking at the 59's due to the slimmer neck.
How thick is the '58?? I'm not sure which neck my LP has because they had 50's and 60's necks for that model that year and I'm not sure which I have.
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Post by zpilot on Nov 19, 2018 11:25:50 GMT -7
R0. I like the slimmer neck and it's going to be closer to what's on your 345. If the repair was done properly on that headstock it's less likely to break than it was before. The weakest part of the grain has been fixed. Reinforced actually. I had heard that for years and tended to believe it, knowing a thing or two about woodworking. Then when I was touring the Gibson Custom Shop a few years ago I watched a tech repairing one a customer had sent in. He said the same thing and also said Gibson guarantees the repair never to break.
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Post by The Bad Poodle Experience on Nov 19, 2018 11:26:11 GMT -7
Here you go. you can quickly browse between the different years to see the neck specs.
R7 - Neck Profile Medium Chunky, .9" depth at nut, 1.0" at 12th fret
R8 - Neck Profile Medium-Chunky C-Shape, .9" depth at nut, 1.0" at 12th fret
R9 - Neck Profile Authentic '59 Medium C-Shape
R0 - Neck Profile Authentic '60 Slim C-Shape
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Post by helmi on Nov 19, 2018 14:04:07 GMT -7
How big are your hands? if there small, definately go with a slim neck.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2018 15:37:37 GMT -7
I think the R-8 is the best deal out these. The necks aren't that big. I have one and I really love it. Mine is a CR-8 (chambered) There's a lot of them out there. I got mine from Mark's Guitar Loft. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend him. Very knowledgable about newer Les Pauls. Real straight shooter.
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Post by premiumplus (Dave) on Nov 19, 2018 15:53:44 GMT -7
Not to derail, but do you fellas buy a high end guitar without playing it first? I've never bought one unless I've played it. What's the success rate if you do buy sight un-played?
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Post by BritInvasion on Nov 19, 2018 15:57:28 GMT -7
I voted R0 . All of them are nice , but I played an R0 and I can't get it out of my mind , the neck was -for me- perfect , the whole guitar was resonant and played like buttah.... Only reason I don't have it was my wallet disagreed with my thinking.
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Post by BritInvasion on Nov 19, 2018 15:58:50 GMT -7
Not to derail, but do you fellas buy a high end guitar without playing it first? I've never bought one unless I've played it. What's the success rate if you do buy sight un-played? I've had a lot of good luck Dave , but I ask a lot of questions and I make real sure it comes with an air-tight return policy.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2018 15:59:37 GMT -7
I own an CR7, a CR8 and an R8. They're all terrific guitars. I think for the price difference the CR8/R8 is probably the best deal. If you can find a chambered one, so much the better--they run about 7.4 lbs compared to about 8.4 for the lightest non-chambered version, and the price difference vs the R9 appears to be $2-3000 on the used market these days. You can find R8s with real nice flame tops, too, if that's what floats yer boat. I've played a few R9s, and the neck contour's nice, but not entirely consistent from one guitar to the next, and not a whole lot different from either of my R8s. My R7 is pretty chunky, but I've gotten to like the feel of it quite a bit, and my hands aren't huge by any means.
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Post by GuitarZ on Nov 19, 2018 16:23:08 GMT -7
I have nothing to add, but I thought it would be cool to see the R8's, R9's, etc only to find out that Gibson doesn't label them that way. Now I get it. I had never bothered to wonder what the R's were. One of these days I'll have to see what my '68 Gold Top compares to. Good luck!
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Post by Andy 67 on Nov 20, 2018 5:11:22 GMT -7
I've had a 57 Goldtop RI, and the neck was chunky, but not as chunky as other 57s or 58s I tried before getting it. Every neck, even though the specs are supposed to be the same, feels different. Now I have a 59 RI, and the neck profile feels more comfortable to me, not so 'shoulder thick', and even with 59s you can get three different neck shapes. I also tried a 60 RI and I fell in love with the neck, a bit thinner (but not veeery much thinner) than my 59. I also have a 335 Rich Robinson , which appears to have a 63 neck profile, and it is my favourite, quite thinner than the 59. Maybe I tend to like thinner necks these days... The R0 will probably have a more similar profile to the one on your 345, so I'd go for it. If you have the chance of trying the guitars, do it, and get what best fits you, that's my 2c. Good luck and tons of tone!!!
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Post by Don on Nov 20, 2018 5:17:40 GMT -7
Close your eyes, use your ears, and go with the one that feels at home in your hands.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2018 6:52:42 GMT -7
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Post by John E. on Nov 20, 2018 7:48:40 GMT -7
Not to derail, but do you fellas buy a high end guitar without playing it first? I've never bought one unless I've played it. What's the success rate if you do buy sight un-played? I've always had good luck buying without playing first. There have been a few times where it just didn't feel right but then I just sell it and try something else.
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Post by Maddog on Nov 20, 2018 8:02:39 GMT -7
Buy it right, and only buy it once! Do it right the first time and have no regrets later.... For me? R9
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Post by digs57 on Nov 20, 2018 8:20:56 GMT -7
Wow that's sweet lee...I do like a R9...what its all about!
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Post by John E. on Nov 20, 2018 8:24:08 GMT -7
I own an CR7, a CR8 and an R8. They're all terrific guitars. I think for the price difference the CR8/R8 is probably the best deal. If you can find a chambered one, so much the better--they run about 7.4 lbs compared to about 8.4 for the lightest non-chambered version, and the price difference vs the R9 appears to be $2-3000 on the used market these days. You can find R8s with real nice flame tops, too, if that's what floats yer boat. I've played a few R9s, and the neck contour's nice, but not entirely consistent from one guitar to the next, and not a whole lot different from either of my R8s. My R7 is pretty chunky, but I've gotten to like the feel of it quite a bit, and my hands aren't huge by any means. Despite Tulsa being a pretty decent sized city, we have very few music stores, especially ones that have Gibsons. Only Guitar Center has them here. And Tulsa GC never has anything higher than the occasional LP Traditional. So I don't have much experience with lot's of different LP's. I'm not sure if mine is chambered of not, whatever it is I love the weight. I've also played a friends Original Black beauty and that thing weighs a ton. But is there REALLY any tonal difference as far as sustain and whatnot in chambered vs solid? Since you own both. I don't usually buy into that type of mumbo but I've never been able to compare the two types.
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Post by John E. on Nov 20, 2018 8:57:50 GMT -7
I found this comparison online, is this fairly accurate to how they actually are?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2018 9:38:40 GMT -7
I own an CR7, a CR8 and an R8. They're all terrific guitars. I think for the price difference the CR8/R8 is probably the best deal. If you can find a chambered one, so much the better--they run about 7.4 lbs compared to about 8.4 for the lightest non-chambered version, and the price difference vs the R9 appears to be $2-3000 on the used market these days. You can find R8s with real nice flame tops, too, if that's what floats yer boat. I've played a few R9s, and the neck contour's nice, but not entirely consistent from one guitar to the next, and not a whole lot different from either of my R8s. My R7 is pretty chunky, but I've gotten to like the feel of it quite a bit, and my hands aren't huge by any means. Despite Tulsa being a pretty decent sized city, we have very few music stores, especially ones that have Gibsons. Only Guitar Center has them here. And Tulsa GC never has anything higher than the occasional LP Traditional. So I don't have much experience with lot's of different LP's. I'm not sure if mine is chambered of not, whatever it is I love the weight. I've also played a friends Original Black beauty and that thing weighs a ton. But is there REALLY any tonal difference as far as sustain and whatnot in chambered vs solid? Since you own both. I don't usually buy into that type of mumbo but I've never been able to compare the two types. I’ve had both solid and chambered. Can’t take the heavy weight anymore on the bandstand. The chambered ones sound older and dryer to me. A little more air in the sound. Also Most good dealers offer some kind of return period.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2018 9:39:27 GMT -7
I found this comparison online, is this fairly accurate to how they actually are? Yes. Except when it’s not 😉
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Post by ME on Nov 20, 2018 10:17:25 GMT -7
I like the bigger necks. Less cramp in the hand. Not that it’s a big problem. Skinny necks make my hand feel uncomfortable. I have no troubles with my shortish fingers from finding all the notes, even the ones I didn’t mean to find! I’m not one for thumb wrapping to play notes on the E or A strings so that isn’t an issue. Les Pauls, like all guitars sound different from one another. Generally in the same ballpark. I voted for the R7. They have had the best necks, usually. I have played som R8’s with nice necks. Not much experience with R9’s, but I don’t believe they are worth the premium price. There are lots of nice reissues from the other years at significantly less cash. Currently I have a R7BB 3 pu. All mahogany, sounds different from the maple capped ones, but still in the ballpark. Searching is fun. Some say the search never ends. ME
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Post by lowbudget on Nov 20, 2018 11:31:15 GMT -7
John, be aware that since 2009 all the standard garden-variety R series LPs have supposedly had the same 1959-ish neck profile. R0s are still a little thinner just like the originals. I say supposedly because there will still be an occasional outlier because they're individually carved just like back in the day. Many people aren't aware of this though, so the misinformation is still out there about how much bigger R8 necks are than R9, etc. when they've all pretty much had a '59 neck profile since 2009. This doesn't apply to specific artist models and other special recreations, just the standard R series LPs.
Therefore, the only real difference between an R8 and an R9 is the top, BUT I've seen and owned some figured top R8s than had better tops than most R9s. For some unknown reason, a lot of the chambered R8s seem to have come with some really unbelievable tops.
Someone gave you good advice about Mark's Guitar Loft, although do be aware that he isn't an authorized Gibson dealer so his guitars are sold as used with no factory warranty. Not really a big deal IMO and he's a straight shooter.
If you need other dealer recommendations hit me with a PM.
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Post by The Bad Poodle Experience on Nov 20, 2018 13:18:59 GMT -7
^^^^ Sounds like legit info BUT my 2010 R8 has a decidedly chunkier neck than any R9 I've ever played. So, go figure.
I think my R8 v. an R9 would look just like the picture a few posts above. The "chunkiness" of the neck comes from increased depth from the fingerboard to the back of the neck and not the width at the nut. The R8 neck shape is a more rounded "C" shape.
Bottom line is ....
try before you Buy.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2018 13:56:46 GMT -7
My 2016 CR8 has a noticeably chunkier neck (a difference of a millimeter or two, at most, keep in mind) than my 2015 R8. My 2014 CR7 (a rare bird, indeed) is chunkier than both of them. So if you're real selective in terms of neck chunk or lack thereof, I'd probably head to a dealer with many examples to choose from--you won't know what you're getting, really, if you buy online. That said, as far as tone is concerned, stock Burstbuckers seem to be pretty consistent.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2018 13:58:27 GMT -7
Despite Tulsa being a pretty decent sized city, we have very few music stores, especially ones that have Gibsons. Only Guitar Center has them here. And Tulsa GC never has anything higher than the occasional LP Traditional. So I don't have much experience with lot's of different LP's. I'm not sure if mine is chambered of not, whatever it is I love the weight. I've also played a friends Original Black beauty and that thing weighs a ton. But is there REALLY any tonal difference as far as sustain and whatnot in chambered vs solid? Since you own both. I don't usually buy into that type of mumbo but I've never been able to compare the two types. I’ve had both solid and chambered. Can’t take the heavy weight anymore on the bandstand. The chambered ones sound older and dryer to me. A little more air in the sound. Also Most good dealers offer some kind of return period. I honestly don't hear a difference. If you tested me blind I'd have no idea which is which.
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Post by ineedtherapy (Stuart) on Nov 20, 2018 22:08:47 GMT -7
Not to derail, but do you fellas buy a high end guitar without playing it first? I've never bought one unless I've played it. What's the success rate if you do buy sight un-played? I too have had good luck, but I have also only kept two guitars over the years and both of those were acquired in the past year or so. My philosophy is to find a good price on a guitar that’s going to have a high floor for failure with room to trade or sale without losing (in case I don’t like what I get). It’s worked for a good while. In fact, I have tended to make a good $4-500 per guitar when doing this. It can be unsatisfying depending on the market though. Sometimes you have to wait it out. I recently acquired a Gary Clark Jr. SG for a really good price. I got it off Reverb from a store that had it listed there. It had some electronics issues, but plays and sounds amazing. Got those bugs worked out and they paid for the work. I don’t intend on selling it.
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Post by ineedtherapy (Stuart) on Nov 20, 2018 22:20:32 GMT -7
@roscoenyc
I don’t know that I have anything valuable to add to the decision either. However, I’ll try. I don’t have any experience with the reissues, but I have owned several Standards and Traditionals. I’ve not kept any of them. I did stumble upon a “well loved” Classic that has outplayed all of my other LPs with humble stock PUPs (57 Classics that are about to be replaced with Lollar Imperials). When it comes to Guibson at this price point, I would probably violate my running philosophy and only buy something I’ve played. It’s quite the investment and Gibson is hit and miss in their builds post-2009. I’ve yet to play one that is garbage (other than some of their cheap sub-studio guitars), but with that kind of financial investment, I’d think it would be a great help to go put my hands on them before buying, if you can.
At the end of the day, you may find a good used LP for a price that would allow you to swap PUPs. My Classic came used with a vintage wiring harness already installed in place of the PCB stuff.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2018 12:04:37 GMT -7
Not to derail, but do you fellas buy a high end guitar without playing it first? I've never bought one unless I've played it. What's the success rate if you do buy sight un-played? There are three dealers I'm willing to buy electrics from without playing--Dave's in La Crosse, Wildwood, and Humbucker, where I've bought a few Nashes. They give you really honest and accurate descriptions, and are happy to provide more detail if you have questions. I wouldn't buy an acoustic without playing it first, though, because they're so variable in tone even if the model, setup and specs are all the same. Electrics are variable, too, just not as much. One Nash S63 with Lollars is going to feel and sound pretty much like twenty other Nash Strats with Lollars. One stock R8 is going to sound a lot like another of similar weight, assuming pickup height, etc., is consistent--although, as we've said, the feel could be noticeably different on those Lesters.
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