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Post by hdahs143 on Nov 22, 2005 21:57:27 GMT -7
Has anybody tried this combo? How did you like it? Is it worth $350.00 for the pair. I read the FAQ on Weber's website about the difference between Alnico and Ceramic speakers and like what I read about the smooth compressed sound of the Alnico.
All opinions welcomed. Thanks
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Post by Bill on Nov 23, 2005 6:07:59 GMT -7
My Z open back has the blue/silver alnicos. It cost an extra $150.00 for the speaker upgrade, and is worth every penny. Not everyone likes the alnicos because they compress under higher volumes, but the feel and sound of a compressing speaker is something that works for me. I have another cabinet with a Vintage 30 if I need a quicker more open attack.
The blue lacks the low end thump, but is magic with the mids and chime. The silver covers the bottom well...a real good working pair. The RxES is an amazing matchup with the cabinet, but for blues/rock my DSL 100 head just screams through the Z cab. It doesn't come close to having the girth or punch of the ES, but still works well, so I've been taking both heads out lately.
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Post by bluzsteel on Nov 23, 2005 7:18:02 GMT -7
compressed for sure! I really hated the tone myself{ both 50watt}. sounded like I had a blanket over my amp, so I ened up with Tonker Swamp combo. having said that at lower volumes Im sure it would work. I just hardly ever play at low volumes
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Post by cementman on Nov 23, 2005 8:16:49 GMT -7
i did my little cd, my audio photo in real time, last year with a trutone open back cab with a weber blue dog and a ceramic. it has a very open sound. i like it a lot. funny, a few years ago mike clark of clarkamplification recommended and sold me a weber blue dog thirty watt, said it was fine for a fender hot rod deluxe i had. but it was way more than farty. i had the right spkr for the wrong amp. i think these spkrs are perfect for Z amps, and i think they were used in Z's a few years ago.
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Post by Bill on Nov 23, 2005 8:19:40 GMT -7
It IS on the "darker" side so I suppose the blanket reference could be somewhat accurate, although I would never describe it quite like that. Use Brad P's tone as a reference...dark, compressed and fat. An RxES is a very bright amp & consequently works well with 50w alnicos. I typically play loud too, ES vol at 3:00, DSL-100 vol at 1:00, no boost or OD pedals with either amp. As always YMMV!
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Post by Buzz Fretwear (Ignatius) on Nov 23, 2005 8:25:48 GMT -7
Weber makes a ceramic version of the Blue Dog which seems like it might be interesting. No alnico compression obviously, but he advertises it as having a bigger bottom. Anyone know anything about these?
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Post by JChance on Nov 24, 2005 18:00:41 GMT -7
I've had both, or all four if we are talking alnico and cermic. I had two 50 watt Alnicos in a Gibson GA-60RV amp I used to have. One Blue Dog and one Silver Bell. The amp was brutally bright in it's stock form, especially with the factory Vintage 30's. The alnico Webers smoothed it out quite a bit, but still couldn't get it to the "warmth factor" I wanted... That's more the fault of the amp than the speakers, though. Currently I've got the ceramic Blue Dog/Silver Bell combo in my MAZ Sr., and love them in that amp. I was looking for a Greenback-type effect, and those two models are Weber's closest. I went with two 30 watter's in the MAZ Sr. They are aggressive, but smooth. Punchy, but not brittle. My MAZ 38 Sr has PLENTY of bottom with that combo. However, the 30 watt versions can get a little *too* aggressive at high volume playing. And I m talking, as in nearly having the amp dimed. On bigger stages, I'm running my MAZ sr. with the volume at about 2 o'clock and the master wide open. Yes, it's loud....but the 30 watt Webers hold up quite well. If I turn the volume to 3 o'clock or higher, they get a little spikey, though. But, it can be fixed by rolling the cut knob back a bit at those volumes. Ted has told me the 50 watt versions aren't any louder, but are a little smoother and have a slightly more bold bottom end. I would imagine the 50's might be even better suited to higher volume playing. I love the ceramics in my Z's. But, I'm not really an alnico kind of guy.....
JC
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Post by hdahs143 on Nov 24, 2005 23:31:57 GMT -7
I feel the same way about the Vintage 30 in my ZBEST with my MAZ SR head. The Maz to me is a fairly bright amp to begin with. I never have either the cut or treble above 9 or 10 o'clock. I'm looking to darken and smooth things up a bit. This will also allow more range in use of the cut and treble controls.
I tend to lean toward a compressed sound anyway, and never knew what role the speaker/magnet played in that. If I can lean on the speakers for some of that, and less from the Keeley to get what I'm looking for, all the better. I know that I definitely prefer the sound of Alnico 2 pickups over ceramics. They're just "sweeter". I'm not sure if that carries over to speakers.
Anyway thanks for the input guys, and keep it coming!
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Post by G'OlPeachPhan on Dec 13, 2005 8:34:04 GMT -7
JC, great rundown on the weber blue and silvers, both alnico and ceramic. I've been considering trying out both the weber blue and silver ceramic models for my Ghia and my Lightning (been on sort of a speaker taste-testing frenzied binge lately), but in your statement that those two speakers are Weber's closest speakers to a Greenback, that's helped me to realize I should stick with what I've got for now... So thanks for potentially saving me some cash, and some time... I'm kind of getting tired of this speaker journey at this point.
That said, can you further comment on how a Greenback directly compares to both the Blue and Silver ceramics? I'm assuming the 30w versions of both would be most comparable to the Greenback (given that a Greenback is 25w). Just for frame of reference, which is most like a Greenback - the ceramic Blue or the ceramic Silver?
I just sent you karma - this information is valuable to me, and I haven't been able to find it anywhere else!
Thanks, Chad
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Post by JChance on Dec 14, 2005 13:15:18 GMT -7
Hey, Peach.... According to Ted, the 30 watt ceramic Blue Dog is his equivalent of a Greenback. The Silver Bell is smoother and has more bottom, more like the late 60's Celestions usually found in Marshall cabs. But, the Webers don't sound exactly like Greenbacks, either. They are still their own unique design. If you want a fat, clear sound with just the right amount of woody-ness, I'd go with a 50 watt Ceramic Silver Bell for your Ghia. I'd say a Silver Bell compares more closely to a G12H30 (although not exactly.) With the Matchless clone you have, either the Silver or the Blue would be awesome. Alnico if you want a fatter/compressed sound. The clips of Paisley playing through the alnico Blue/Silver on Dr Z's site and on Weber's site are a pretty good example of how they sound. Fat, compressed, but still clear. What exactly are you looking for?
Jayson
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Post by G'OlPeachPhan on Dec 20, 2005 15:37:57 GMT -7
Hey, Peach.... According to Ted, the 30 watt ceramic Blue Dog is his equivalent of a Greenback. The Silver Bell is smoother and has more bottom, more like the late 60's Celestions usually found in Marshall cabs. But, the Webers don't sound exactly like Greenbacks, either. They are still their own unique design. If you want a fat, clear sound with just the right amount of woody-ness, I'd go with a 50 watt Ceramic Silver Bell for your Ghia. I'd say a Silver Bell compares more closely to a G12H30 (although not exactly.) With the Matchless clone you have, either the Silver or the Blue would be awesome. Alnico if you want a fatter/compressed sound. The clips of Paisley playing through the alnico Blue/Silver on Dr Z's site and on Weber's site are a pretty good example of how they sound. Fat, compressed, but still clear. What exactly are you looking for? Jayson Jayson - looking to get the tones of my dreams out of my head and coming through the speakers of course! ;D Actually, I'm just on a kick right now to try as many speakers as I can to find THE perfect combinations of speakers in my 3 different 2x12 cabs... I'm really close on completing my mission, and your advice is a help to getting one step closer. THANK YOU MUCH!
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