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Post by dock66 on Sept 26, 2006 12:29:46 GMT -7
D.weller,
Man,that is alot of man hours for those pedals shoot out.Thanks for sharing your result.
+ Karma for you.
dock66
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Post by guitarstan on Sept 26, 2006 12:43:29 GMT -7
+ karma for that well done testing. I have a BB on it's way here from Lefty that will go in with my RC, AC and OCD. I have not yet found the AC that useful for my needs, but I know it is sometimes just a matter of tweak'age and location in the signal path, very complex interrelationships. I am a little surprised not to see a compressor? I have been experimenting with a Keeley comp at the head and tail of the signal path in relation to the boosters and OD's, the jury is still out. Currently I have it in the middle and like it pretty much. I'll spend a few days with it this way and then swithch it all around and then back again. I take it you keep the "Drive" low on the OCD for light grit, what about the volume and tone settings? for say light and or med gain?
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Post by dock66 on Sept 26, 2006 12:57:39 GMT -7
I am glad to see four of my favorite pedals in the shootout. RC,BB, Fulltone FD II and OCD.No comps ,though. dock66
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Post by hdahs143 on Sept 26, 2006 17:31:17 GMT -7
Thanks for the shootout Dan! +1. After reading all of this, I'm starting to think that maybe the AC is NOT the one to start with. I'd like to hear the RC, but going by all the descriptions, my Addrock Boostmaster seems to cover those bases. But the thing that all the Xotic pedals have that grab me is the the EQ setup. Being able to fine tune the EQ is something that, good or bad, I have to be able to do. I could never play a guitar without a tone knob if ya know what I mean. Might have to try the BB first. I like smooth, singing tones, and I like hearing words like, "articulate" and "clarity" in descriptions of this pedal. I've heard alot of good things about the AC, but it sounds like between the drive pedals I already have (Keeley TS9 & BD2, and my Fulltone Fulldrive), I've got the AC's attributes covered. I hate G.A.S. I'm happy with my tone now, but you always wonder how much better it could be Harold
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Post by skydog958 on Sept 26, 2006 17:40:08 GMT -7
I just sweetspotted my BB w/ my Heritage...with just guitar-to-amp I get good crunch tones with some light tube compression, but just not enough sustain or gain for leads.
I've had trouble with the BB and the 535 before because at my usual settings (gain and volume at 10-11 o'clock) it feedsback alot. So I set the BB for a clean boost (vol near 3 o'clock), just to boost the signal a little bit, then added just a hint of gain (7-8 o'clock) to add the harmonics and sustain I like for leads. I'm still tweaking, but I like the BB alot w/ almost every guitar I own.
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Post by guitarstan on Sept 26, 2006 18:27:46 GMT -7
I just sweetspotted my BB w/ my Heritage...with just guitar-to-amp I get good crunch tones with some light tube compression, but just not enough sustain or gain for leads. I've had trouble with the BB and the 535 before because at my usual settings (gain and volume at 10-11 o'clock) it feedsback alot. So I set the BB for a clean boost (vol near 3 o'clock), just to boost the signal a little bit, then added just a hint of gain (7-8 o'clock) to add the harmonics and sustain I like for leads. I'm still tweaking, but I like the BB alot w/ almost every guitar I own. +karma your way skydog, you gave me some new ideas how to set pedal'age.....
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Post by (8^D) on Sept 27, 2006 9:53:52 GMT -7
I am glad to see four of my favorite pedals in the shootout. RC,BB, Fulltone FD II and OCD.No comps ,though. dock66 Thanks for the karma! I did have a Keeley Comp on the board, tried them all with it on and off. Should have mentioned, but wasn't something I needed to evalutate as a boost/drive pedal in the 'shoot out'. It's just a great compressor...and I use it as such - vs a boost which I already had several to try. DW
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Post by (8^D) on Sept 27, 2006 10:02:02 GMT -7
+ karma for that well done testing. I have a BB on it's way here from Lefty that will go in with my RC, AC and OCD. I have not yet found the AC that useful for my needs, but I know it is sometimes just a matter of tweak'age and location in the signal path, very complex interrelationships. I am a little surprised not to see a compressor? I have been experimenting with a Keeley comp at the head and tail of the signal path in relation to the boosters and OD's, the jury is still out. Currently I have it in the middle and like it pretty much. I'll spend a few days with it this way and then swithch it all around and then back again. I take it you keep the "Drive" low on the OCD for light grit, what about the volume and tone settings? for say light and or med gain? Appreciate the Karma, thanks! I actually did have a Keeley Comp in the path - I love it as a comp and had enough other pedals to try as boosts so I didn't put it in there. Ran it on/off w/each of the others as well. Really love that compressor. I experiemented a few years back with the Keeley Comp placement find it works best for me at present pre-drive/boost. Re: OCD, it's an older version: HP V=10 T=10 G=8/9 depending on the pup output.
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Post by dock66 on Sept 27, 2006 10:09:45 GMT -7
I am glad to see four of my favorite pedals in the shootout. RC,BB, Fulltone FD II and OCD.No comps ,though. dock66 Thanks for the karma! I did have a Keeley Comp on the board, tried them all with it on and off. Should have mentioned, but wasn't something I needed to evalutate as a boost/drive pedal in the 'shoot out'. It's just a great compressor...and I use it as such - vs a boost which I already had several to try. DW You are quite welcome. dock66
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Post by (8^D) on Sept 27, 2006 10:11:47 GMT -7
Thanks for the shootout Dan! +1. After reading all of this, I'm starting to think that maybe the AC is NOT the one to start with. I'd like to hear the RC, but going by all the descriptions, my Addrock Boostmaster seems to cover those bases. But the thing that all the Xotic pedals have that grab me is the the EQ setup. Being able to fine tune the EQ is something that, good or bad, I have to be able to do. I could never play a guitar without a tone knob if ya know what I mean. Might have to try the BB first. I like smooth, singing tones, and I like hearing words like, "articulate" and "clarity" in descriptions of this pedal. I've heard alot of good things about the AC, but it sounds like between the drive pedals I already have (Keeley TS9 & BD2, and my Fulltone Fulldrive), I've got the AC's attributes covered. I hate G.A.S. I'm happy with my tone now, but you always wonder how much better it could be Harold Sounds like you're in a similar situation - the AC is a nice pedal, but there are already several in the stable that do the same as well or better. RE: RC, I love the Keeley Katana but went with the RC because of the EQ capabilities. It's nice to be able to roll some top end off if you're playing mellow and want a sweet lead or add some top end if you're kicking it in for some rock leads - get that sizzle on! I'm keeping a Katana in the gear bag just in case. I'm really blown away by the BB...I was using a Barber DD for those gain tones, but the BB gets the gain but keeps the clarity/articulation. I will say the Barber (w/mid boost up) gets the coolest early EVH Brown Sound though...I still haven't found another pedal that nails it that well! The Keeley SD1 has the same clarity as the BB, but I find the SD1 adds a noticable woof to the low end - great for rock 'chunk' but not for the stuff I'm doing now. That's another keeper pedal! Appreciate the Karma!
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Post by deltone on Sept 27, 2006 14:27:15 GMT -7
Awesome, d.weller! +1 for you for the shootout. Man was that good timing. I'm getting ready to plunk down some coins on a boost and an od pedal. Read many a thread about each of those included in your shootout. I had pretty much narrowed it down to the Xotics. Now I can feel comfortable about making a decision. I'm leaning toward the RC and the BB. However, the good reviews on here about the Keeley BD2 still have me intrigued. Is the BD2 covered by either of the Xotics or would it be a good third pedal? (RC for boost, BB for crunch/lead, BD2 for o/d). Wonder how any of those compare to the Analogman TS-9 that I've had for a long time and really like?
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Post by hdahs143 on Sept 27, 2006 14:57:51 GMT -7
I (and several others) use the Keeley BD2 for light breakup stuff, and it is phenomenal. That with my Addrock Boostmaster nails that country dirt sound ala Paisley or Urban. I expect you would get similar results combined with the Xotic RC Booster. It is really a great pedal, and MUCH more transparent than any TS9 type pedal.
I personally don't care for it in higher gain situations, as to me it starts sounding too edgy
Harold
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Post by skydog958 on Sept 27, 2006 18:37:12 GMT -7
Right back atcha, guitarstan! Tell me if you find any other good settings!
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Post by (8^D) on Sept 27, 2006 19:15:19 GMT -7
Awesome, d.weller! +1 for you for the shootout. Is the BD2 covered by either of the Xotics or would it be a good third pedal? (RC for boost, BB for crunch/lead, BD2 for o/d). Wonder how any of those compare to the Analogman TS-9 that I've had for a long time and really like? deltone, appreciate the feedback - great bunch of folks on here. Regarding the BD/RC/TS questions, I was using the BD like I use the OCD now - light clip/grit. I prefer the OCD for it's more natural amp-like character at low amp volumes, has a bit softer response. The Keeley BD2 is a keeper pedal - I LOVE it, very transparent, but stiffer w/a clean amp. Works wonders with an amp that can get a little greasy - really responsive. You could get into those colors with a low gained AC or a higher gained RC, but they would be different. Just depends on how you'd want to use the BD or Xotic pedals.: i.e.as a boost or drive/gain pedal. Re: Analogman TS9, I haven't had the opportunity to play with one - but if you're after that TS9 tone (i.e. smooth med gain with a noticeable mid-hump and limited low end) the FDII in Vintage mode or any of the modded TS9 pedals will easily get you there as well - I'd even throw in the Bad Monkey, it's a GREAT TS'esque pedal especially for the money - just use the mixer out rather than the standard out to the amp. They'd be like buying vanilla ice cream at the store - a general category with a LOT of minor changes for each palate - Whole Bean, French Vanilla, Old Fashioned, etc.
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Post by (8^D) on Sept 27, 2006 19:25:55 GMT -7
D.weller, Man,that is alot of man hours for those pedals shoot out. dock66 Not many road dates this month. Too much time at home and I get REALLY gear geeky/tweaky. ;D
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Post by rhythmeister on Oct 11, 2006 2:52:10 GMT -7
OK, y'all convinced me to dive in and buy an Xotic BB. But b/c I'm cheap I ordered a used one (at a good price).
Here's a question - looks like I got the older model (if a device that debuted in 2005 can have an "older" model). This is the one with the LED right above the switch, rather than near the top of the box. Other than that cosmetic change, are there any differences that you know of b/w the older BB and the new model?
Cheers, Blair
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2006 10:11:03 GMT -7
OK, y'all convinced me to dive in and buy an Xotic BB. But b/c I'm cheap I ordered a used one (at a good price). Here's a question - looks like I got the older model (if a device that debuted in 2005 can have an "older" model). This is the one with the LED right above the switch, rather than near the top of the box. Other than that cosmetic change, are there any differences that you know of b/w the older BB and the new model? Cheers, Blair Hi Blair, the BB pedal had a revoicing pretty early in its production. Yours is a older one with out the revoicing. The new ones that have been revoiced have the LED at the top of the pedal. You can send it back to Xotic and for $20 will revoice the pedal for you. It will have less compression, thus having a more open natural sound. Well worth it. Peace. Arun
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Post by rhythmeister on Oct 11, 2006 10:36:04 GMT -7
Hi Blair, the BB pedal had a revoicing pretty early in its production. Yours is a older one with out the revoicing. The new ones that have been revoiced have the LED at the top of the pedal. You can send it back to Xotic and for $20 will revoice the pedal for you. It will have less compression, thus having a more open natural sound. Well worth it. Peace. Arun Thanks very much Arun! Your timely response may change my decision - I might just buck up for the new one instead (the seller I'm dealing with has both new & used). I personally don't want the hassle of having to send the pedal off to the manufacturer as soon as I get it... If I had any karma to give, you'd get some from me! Cheers, Blair
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Post by rhythmeister on Oct 11, 2006 10:50:28 GMT -7
Here's something interesting (at least to me), though. I was rewatching that Allen Hinds video from the Xotic website - the one that pushed so many people, it seems, into springing for the BB - and he is definitely using the older model (LED right above the switch). Was his revoiced? Or is the fact that it is an older one the reason why several people who bought the new one say they can't seem to get Allen's sound from that video?
Cheers, Blair
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Post by rhythmeister on Oct 11, 2006 11:18:30 GMT -7
Hi Blair, the BB pedal had a revoicing pretty early in its production. Yours is a older one with out the revoicing. Arun Hi Arun, So I just spoke to the dealer (who is an authorized Xotic dealer) and he says he's never heard of the BB being revoiced. He did advise me of the changes made to the footswitch device to ensure it was more sturdy in the new model, but he's puzzled by the revoicing thing. Can you tell me where you found out about it? Is there anything on the internet about it? Cheers, Blair
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Post by Strato on Oct 11, 2006 15:03:46 GMT -7
I recently got an AC Booster to use with my Maz 18. Incredible is the all I can say.
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Post by rhythmeister on Oct 11, 2006 15:41:18 GMT -7
Well, straight from the horse's mouth, it looks like Arun had it spot on. I called Prosound (the makers of Xotic pedals) today and left a message asking them to confirm what Arun had indicated - that the BB had been "revoiced". I got a call back (message) from Toshio at Prosound (he also moderates the Xotic Forum). Toshio indicated in the message that "yes, they can change/modify the old model BB to the new version" at a cost of $30 US plus shipping. Since I did not mention the footswitch issue in my message - I only mentioned voicing - I assume this confirms that the new model sounds different than the old model. Now I'm torn. The old model (used) was offered to me for $70 US less than a new one. The dealer is happy to sell me either. Any advice/opinions? Cheers, Blair
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Post by rhythmeister on Oct 11, 2006 16:09:38 GMT -7
Now I'm torn. The old model (used) was offered to me for $70 US less than a new one. The dealer is happy to sell me either. Any advice/opinions? Cheers, Blair I should add that the dealer is not local, so I can't A/B the old vs. new or take one home for a trial really... Cheers, Blair
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Post by garyh on Oct 11, 2006 17:07:52 GMT -7
I believe it is the AC, not BB that was revoiced. The AC was given more gain and less compression. The BB just got a better switch. Also, I don't think Allen uses the BB anymore. He uses an OCD instead. He loves the new AC, however. Here is a link to a picture of his latest pedal board. thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=174394&highlight=allen+hinds
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Post by rhythmeister on Oct 13, 2006 11:58:38 GMT -7
Just to close the loop on this new vs. old BB thing (at least on my end), the dealer I was going through decided to A/B the old and new BB to see if he could find differences. The result was that he did find clear differences.
If I can paraphrase his results, he told me that the old version, if you crank the gain, compresses a lot more than the new version at the same setting. However, he felt that the old version could be dialled in to produce the same sounds as the new version, mainly by rolling off the gain. He thought the new pedal's gain setting seemed to cut off before reaching the level of compression seen on the old one. He thought the gain setting on the old one was more sensitive and required more dialling in than the new one.
This was news to him, as he had not known of the "revoicing" of the BB before.
Cheers, Blair
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Post by dock66 on Oct 15, 2006 7:59:03 GMT -7
Blair,Thanks for heads up.
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Post by guitarboy02451 on Oct 17, 2006 8:58:35 GMT -7
I have an AC and I love it. If I had to only have two pedals on my board, This would be #1 and my EBS Dynoverb would be #2. Thats it.
pg
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messenger
Full Member
life is good!
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Post by messenger on Oct 17, 2006 10:04:28 GMT -7
i have the bb xotic, & i'm still trying learn it. it behaves differently to different settings on the maz jr, especially to the vol. & master vol. settings. i do really like the pedal though. very musical, & not a bad sound at any setting really. coments welcome........
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2006 22:54:35 GMT -7
Hi guys, did not know all this stuff had happened while I was unavailable. I have been really busy of late. The BB did have a revoicing as you guys know. I actually bought a BB after watching Scott Henderson's clip. I liked Allen Hind's clips because he runs through all three pedals and gives a pretty good overview of what each pedal can do. I also heard about the revoicing from Scott Henderson and John Suhr. I think because the BB was revoiced so soon in it's production it did not get as much press as new AC booster.
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