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Post by mikevb on Aug 30, 2016 5:24:14 GMT -7
I've read and assume it's somewhat Fendery thanks to the 6v6 tubes.
But I can't get a clear picture of whether it's more more tweed, brown, or blackface?
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Post by Jaguarguy (Mike) on Aug 30, 2016 6:22:31 GMT -7
Hey Mike - welcome to the Forum - a lot of great people and information. With regard to the Z-28 definitely in the Fender camp but I think everyone hears something a little different and has a different opinion as to what is tweed, brown, and black-face. Doc doesn't really copy amp tones so it's not going to be a copy of any of those tones. Best thing to do is listen to as many videos/recordings as you can and then decide which one you like. Speakers and guitars make such a difference that you almost need to get your set-up and play through them.
To start you off, here is Don playing through the Z-28 with his 335 at mini-ZFest. I believe he was playing straight into the amp.
Here is a general description of the Z amps and their tones that was collected from a variety of sources:
Antidote - Marshall tones – with a vintage/modern switch that takes the amp from 1960’s JTM45 to 1970s JCMs. The Antidote also features a “Vintage/Modern” circuit which gives the user the ability to time warp the amp’s voicing from mid 60’s to early 70’s and back again with the flip of a switch (yes, we refer to the 70’s as modern). When over-driven, the Antidote is smooth as silk. Mids and top and bottom balance are strong and thick when pushed with a Humbucker. The addictive blend of bell-like high end shimmer and thick punchy lows results in a sound that is difficult to unplug from. In the good doctor’s words: “it already sounds like a record…but cranked”.
Carmen Ghia Clean notes come out with a warmth, complexity, and sustain like one has never heard from such a small amp. Every note has a hugeness to it that seems far beyond an 18 watt head. All this comes before the amp really starts to sing. As you turn the Volume clockwise, the fun factor increases. The big clean notes get even BIGGER than they were before. Sustain becomes as smooth and musical as you have ever heard it.
Delta 88 Best full, sustaining, 3 dimensional clean tones this side of a 100 watt Plexi.
EZG 50 The EZG-50 is the blackface head that never was...ala Dr Z! It has a very definitive 6L6 clean sound. Whether you are lusting after the classic "El Mocambo" tone, looking to surf the big waves, or want twang straight out of Bakersfield. The EZG-50 will satisfy the most discriminating blackface tone seeker.
Galaxie The Galaxie is a channel switching (via footswitch) amp that combines classic Fender-style tweed clean tones and smooth modern drive sounds. The clean channel nails the sweet swirling sound of classic tweed amps that have become the foundation of electric guitar tone. The drive channel is the result of Dr Z’s 20 plus years of design experience. You’ll find it has excellent sustain and a rich open sound with plenty of gain on tap for today’s needs.
JAZ 20/40 Output tube tremolo gives you a depth not heard with pedals or opticoupler circuits. You get deep pulsating swells of tremolo from the JAZ. Whether you desire slow and mellow or faster Bo Didley sounds you can dial it in with ease via the speed and depth controls. Add in the tube driven reverb and you'll be navigating the swamps of the bayou.
KT 45 Sonically the KT-45 captures the rich tones of the WHO's "Live at Leeds" LP. It combines powerful driving distorted tones with a touch of defined articulation. VOX AC-30/4 meets HiWatt.
M12 - Think of the M12 as the perfect half powered offspring of the Z Wreck and Stang Ray. You get the clarity of the Stang Ray with the sweetness and ease of the Z Wreck. The Dr Z M12 gives you big tone and clean headroom with 12 watts of power. Designed with the pedal board player in mind, the EF86 front end will devour your pedals and make them sound like they are built into the amp.
MAZ 18 Jr. The Maz 18 has the perfect combination of front end drive and output tube distortion. It has a wonderful 3D reverb clean tone, matched with the sweetest top end response and tightest bottom end in a lower powered amp. All this has made the Maz 18 our most popular selling reverb combo to date.
The Maz 18 NR has that certain old school attitude that comes alive under your fingers. You can dial in clean chimey tones or raw vintage drive. The NR delivers rich singing tones from single coils and sweet British crunch from humbuckers.
MAZ 38 NR Originally built as a 3x10 combo at the request of Joe Walsh, the ever-versatile Maz 38 NR. The 38 NR will give you plenty of clean headroom and sweet driven tones for stages of all sizes. MAZ 38 SR Whether your forte' is Blues, Country, Roots, or Rock, The MAZ 38 Senior will fit the bill.
Mazerati - A higher-powered companion to Dr. Z’s popular Carmen Ghia head, the Mazerati delivers rich, beautifully detailed tones that offer a pointed, yet musical midrange. And though the top-end blooms with a touch of AC30 chime—a detail that was best revealed with a Strat—the Mazerati’s pugnacious midrange and swift attack make it a decidedly more carnivorous animal than an AC30.
Mazerati GT Achieves that elusive “boutique” high gain tone. The GT uses the time tested output transformer designed for us by Ken Fischer. The gain comes on fast and strong allowing you to simply use the volume knob on your guitar to provide sparkling clean tones.
Mini-Z The breakup begins lightly at around 9 o'clock on the dial, and the sound gets fatter and fatter with more gain as you turn up the volume. Want a nice & crunchy rhythm tone? It's at about 10-11 o'clock. Want a nice, sustaining tone for leads? It's at high-noon. Want ZZ-top? It's at about 2-3 o'clock. Want over the top saturation? Crank it all the way up. The amp gets both louder AND more distorted as you turn it up, so it's "quite a ride." Most will find a happy setting between 12 and 2 o'clock and control the volume and tone with their guitar.
Monza The Monza is a gain and sustain monster. It excels at giving your fingers back what they put in with the feel and response of an amp 5x its power. Chords ring strong while single notes rise and bloom. It’s like harnessing the power and response of a 100 watt stack without clearing the first 20 rows. The term “Billy in a Box” has been used to describe the Monza. It’s that and so much more.
Prescription RX - The Prescription is a British-voiced amplifier with its own distinct personality. The tone of this amp screams rock and roll when cranked, but when clean, its bell-like tone and piano-like clarity on the low notes gives excellent articulation on complex chords. The Prescription is complex and rich in harmonics, and gives incredible touch sensitivity and string-to-finger feel. So whether you're looking for clean and pretty, or crunch of doom for some rippin' blues slide, the 'Script may be the amp for you.
Prescription ES A collaboration between master Tele player Brad Paisley, and Mike Zaite has given birth to the all new Prescription Extra Strength. Dr Z's old friend (and avid supporter of Z Amps since 1989) Joe Walsh demo'd the RX ES and ordered one on the spot to use on the Eagles Oct '04 tour of Japan. Look and listen to his Blonde RX ES on new Eagles' releases, and upcoming shows.
Prescription ES Junior The Prescription Junior Strength (Rx Jr.) has all the same sonic characteristics of the RX ES, but at less than half the power.
Remedy The full on assault and sweet crunch of the Plexi style circuit. Using four 6V6s and coming in at 40 watts you have all the spit and growl on hand for burning your guitar at Monterey or playing High Voltage rock and roll.
Route 66 Marshall JTM 45 style sounds This tube generates the “Milkshake Thick” tones, as heard on John Mayall’s “Bluesbreaker” album featuring Eric Clapton (the “Beano Album” as it is known to many).
SRZ 65 Gain and power combine to deliver pure crunch making this the ultimate rock amp. Simply roll the volume back on your guitar and you’ll hear the shimmering bell like cleans from the EL34s. The SRZ-65 is perfect for dialing up modern and classic rock sounds as well as old school British Steel. Think Marshall JCM 900
Stangray The Stang Ray is the result of his second collaboration with superstar country guitarist Brad Paisley. Using the classic setup of a quartet of EL84's biased close to true Class A at 30 watts, the new Stang Ray tips its hat to classic British tones (think Vox), but like all Dr.Z amps, has its own unique voice.
Surgical Steel - The perfect amp for the modern pedal steel player. The Surgical Steel incorporates Z's unique EF86 font end. This pentode tube can accept inputs of various voltages, like those from volume pedals, and reproduce them with accurate symmetry without distorting the signal disproportionately as 12AX7 input tubes do. A full balance EQ section inputs a pair of ultra-linear connected KT88 power tubes. These powerful tubes (approximately 90 watts per pair) produce a rich, warm, and thick tone which is not possible with a solid state amp.
Therapy A 6L6 based amp with the flavor of a low-power Tweed Twin – an American-type overdrive sound. Tweed-Twin clean with a modern clarity.
Z-28 Having more of an American type sound, the Z28 gives you a wide pallet to work from. You can dial in a clear, sweet clean sound as well as a biting crunch with just 3 knobs. The Z-28 falls squarely in the Fender camp. With my Tele plugged into the Z-28, I was instantly struck by the amp’s sugary-sweet treble and lilting midrange—Fender-like traits for sure, but the Z-28 sports a decidedly bolder, punchier low-end toughness, as well as a snappier response to pick attack.
Z-Lux - the underlying flavour is vintage and Fender-like, but thankfully devoid of the lifeless feel and glassy trebles that are sometimes associated with the more powerful silverface models. At full power, the Z-lux has a big three-dimensional tone that feels supple and dynamic with single coils as well as humbuckers. For clean tones, max out the master control and turn the gain up to achieve the optimum volume level. With single coils, things should stay clean so long as the gain control doesn’t pass halfway
Z-Wreck - There’s plenty of Vox-y character to this amp in terms of lively top end, but the rich, full and complex mid range is really something special. Every last drop of tone is rung out of those Alnico speakers and the transient response – the clarity of the initial note attack before it blooms into natural valve compression and sustain – is simply joyous. Plugging in a Telecaster, we can see why Brad Paisley is such a fan of this amp. The bridge pickup’s brightness and twang are here, along with huge dollops of meaty mid range snarl, but the highs never become sharp or unpleasant. Perhaps more surprising is how great this amp sounds with a Les Paul – chunkier than Leslie West, but still with that astonishing bite and clarity that makes each note seem to pop and shimmer.
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Post by pcns on Aug 30, 2016 7:45:33 GMT -7
Need to bookmark this post
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Post by Ridgeback on Aug 30, 2016 8:07:38 GMT -7
The Z-28 is my favorite Z model and I'll probably own another if I can find a good deal on a blonde one. I have experience with a lot of vintage Fenders. The best comparison I have for the Z-28 is a Brown Princeton on steroids. I've seen a number of comparisons to the Brown Deluxe but all of the Deluxes I have played were total gain machines and not like the gain profile and tone of the Z-28 at all. Just my perspective.
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Post by bgkyt1 on Aug 31, 2016 6:14:11 GMT -7
my vote is that it's like a brownface. it's a nice clean platform, then overdrives nicely when cranked, like maybe a brownface showman or tremolux. (but less power)
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Post by Stephen on Aug 31, 2016 6:40:49 GMT -7
I've never had a brown or a tweed, but I've had plenty of Deluxe Reverbs. Since the Z-Lux covers that territory, it must be something else. Eric Ambel says brown in his excellent video, so let's go with that. All I know for sure is that 3,3,3 with a Humbucker = greatness.
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Post by Jaguarguy (Mike) on Aug 31, 2016 10:58:05 GMT -7
I read an article today where they compared it to Tweed Deluxes and Tremoluxes.
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Aug 31, 2016 12:35:33 GMT -7
Warm & fat. Brownface deluxe clean to marshall crunch. Still one of Doc's favorites, too, apparently..!
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Post by Maddog on Aug 31, 2016 14:27:35 GMT -7
I've always heard they sound like a Brown Deluxe, but I've had a Brown Deluxe, and it was fairly anemic compared to a Z-28. I really think the Z-28 sounds very close to the Brown Vibrolux or Blonde Tremolux (both share identical circuitry) which run a pair of 5881's or 6L6's. Here's a couple of my favorite amps: (and they sound a lot like a Z-28).
1961 Brown Vibrolux
1961 Blonde Tremolux
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Post by Ridgeback on Aug 31, 2016 14:54:32 GMT -7
Maddog,
I have a 61 Brown Super and a 62 blonde bassman piggyback. I agree that the Z-28 has a character like one of the big bottle Brown\blonde amps (probably the big iron in the Z) but I hear enough of the 6V6 in the Z-28 to have gone with the Brown Princeton on steroids call. Beautiful amps by the way. I almost bought a 61 Tremolux amp\cab like that a few months ago. Leo's greatest cosmetic combination IMO and why I'm casually looking for a blonde Z-28 head.
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Post by Maddog on Aug 31, 2016 15:24:59 GMT -7
Maddog, I agree that the Z-28 has a character like one of the big bottle Brown\blonde amps (probably the big iron in the Z) but I hear enough of the 6V6 in the Z-28 to have gone with the Brown Princeton on steroids call. Yeah, I know what you mean..... I guess I prolly shudda stated the Killer TONE of the smaller 6V6 fenders is def in there, but the Z-28 seems to have more of a THUMP to it like a big bottle brown/blonde amp....I guess the 28's tone has the best of both worlds! (Would love to see pix of yer old fenders!)
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Post by Ridgeback on Aug 31, 2016 16:09:50 GMT -7
Here you go: "Scarface" the bassman No name for the Super.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2016 18:20:34 GMT -7
This thread reminds me that I need to re-purchase a Z28...
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Post by Maddog on Sept 1, 2016 9:38:32 GMT -7
Here you go: "Scarface" the bassman No name for the Super. Mmmmmmmmmm....... NICE!!!!!
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Post by sidnitzerglobin on Oct 12, 2016 14:13:41 GMT -7
Within my frame of reference it strikes me as vintage Deluxe mixed a bit of w/ EF86 Vox. Only had mine since the weekend however and have only played it through my Z-Best cab so far.
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Post by BW on Oct 12, 2016 22:53:04 GMT -7
Z28 thru a Celestion G12h100, no pedals except for a tuner. Guitar is a heritage h140 loaded w/ Duncan Seth Lovers...
here's a Lentz HSL into a ZVerb (thanks Walter!) and the same Z28 and Cab
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brion
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Post by brion on Oct 13, 2016 19:00:23 GMT -7
Z28 thru a Celestion G12h100, no pedals except for a tuner. Guitar is a heritage h140 loaded w/ Duncan Seth Lovers... here's a Lentz HSL into a ZVerb (thanks Walter!) and the same Z28 and Cab Jeez Buddy, mine doesn't quite sound as good as yours for some reason. Maybe it is just me? Great clips.
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Post by BW on Oct 13, 2016 23:27:27 GMT -7
Well thanks. I REALLY like the Z28 with a Z-Verb, trouble is they are both the same size and that is one more road case to carry. Someday I will get one of my own but I sure do appreciate a lot of you fellas keeping me stocked up on the gig.
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Post by Christopher on Oct 14, 2016 4:43:42 GMT -7
BW-those tones are why I loved my Z-28. The only reason I don't have it anymore is bc I prefer an onboard reverb and smaller footprint. Maybe someday the good Doc will make a Z-28 w reverb and tremolo in a studio cab package and then we'll have the quintessential 6V6 powerhouse. Incredible playing as always in your videos. Those were the best sonic adjectives to describe the '28 I've heard. Thanks for sharing.
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Post by Joey Beverages on Oct 25, 2016 5:22:27 GMT -7
Z-28 .... various shades of Fender Clean to mean with lotsa goodness I-between Driven with a good dual humbucker guitar it's a beautifully overdriven beast Clean with a Strat or Tele is always worth the play-time
I've been a steady Z-28 player since 2006 .... initially with a stock standard old-style Z 210 cab circa 2006 (which I still got).... and later with a stock standard old-style Z 112 cab circa 2007 (which I still got - and still loaded with the V30 that it shipped with)
The Z-28 helped me leave behind various vintage/non-vintage Fender Twins .... Super Reverbs .... and vintage Traynor Bass Mate/Guitar Mate/Bass Master ......and a few others
Bottom line .... I surely haven't really answered your question ....... but I will say that the Z-28 voicing will cover sweet, fat, rich, strong clean and stronger driven tones ....... never mind how well it plays with pedals
cheers always,
Joel
edit: But I can't get a clear picture of whether it's more more tweed, brown, or blackface ......
In my humble opinion based on the sounds and songs I've played ..... there is a delightful combination of tweed n brown at play when using the Z-28
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2016 13:46:26 GMT -7
These are my homeboys. Most of the guitars on this album were recorded with my old Z28 (I didn't play on the record, just lent gear). Rock N Roll, dudes!!!
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