|
Post by southmusic70 on Feb 23, 2016 8:42:26 GMT -7
I just posted this in the Maz 18 section a little earlier.
For those of you who own or have owned the Therapy and Maz 18 NR, I am looking for a comparison/contrasting of these two amps.
I really like the Therapy but am looking at the Maz since, for jobs, I don't need the power/headroom that the Therapy offers and will mike the amp if need be.
I know the two amps are different animals; I'm attracted to the Maz because of its versatility.
I appreciate any assistance you can give me.
Thanks.
|
|
|
Post by simpleton on Feb 23, 2016 9:01:04 GMT -7
Well...I would venture that the MAZ has a bit more Vox and Marshall sound while the Therapy might be able to get that American sound in as well. Also, the MV on the Therapy makes it good anywhere with any setting...either clean or dirty.
The MAZ is available in a stock combo and that helps for gigs. Others with more info and experience will surely offer more.....
|
|
|
Post by Ed M. on Feb 23, 2016 9:31:02 GMT -7
I'm not sure I understand what the Therapy isn't giving you that your looking to the Maz Jr. for. If your running the Therapy turned down so much that you feel your not hitting the sweet spot then the Maz may fit the bill. I loved my Maz Jr. NR with single coils but not as much with humbuckers. YMMV.
|
|
|
Post by benttop (Steve) on Feb 23, 2016 9:36:53 GMT -7
Both great amps. I loved my Maz Jr but it was just too heavy (1x12 combo) so she's gone now. But it was one of the best sounding amps I've ever owned.
I don't have gig experience with the Therapy, but it is also a wonderful sounding amp, especially for single coils. I don't like it as well with humbuckers, but YMMV - everyone hears things differently.
I have a friend locally who plays in an AC/DC tribute band. He plays a Maz Jr through a Z-Best and his SG gives a very convincing performance with that setup.
I think you're going to want to play both of them to make a decision.
|
|
|
Post by simpleton on Feb 23, 2016 10:13:03 GMT -7
I'm not sure I understand what the Therapy isn't giving you that your looking to the Maz Jr. for. If your running the Therapy turned down so much that you feel your not hitting the sweet spot then the Maz may fit the bill. I loved my Maz Jr. NR with single coils but not as much with humbuckers. YMMV. Wouldn't you think the MAZ would be too loud if the Therapy isn't hitting the sweet spot? Usually my thinking of sweet spot involves louder volume. The one plus on the MAZ would be available reverb but OP says NR would be preferred. I might think the drive tones would compress more with EL84 vs 6L6 and that might be more desirable.
|
|
|
Post by dreamlander on Feb 23, 2016 10:52:04 GMT -7
I am in a similar boat, but maybe for different reasons. I am a Therapy owner, but am looking to get a Maz 18 just to try something different. I definitely don't need more very versatility than the Therapy. Seems I can get a great variety of sounds from the Therapy at whatever volume I want.
|
|
|
Post by simpleton on Feb 23, 2016 10:56:38 GMT -7
I am in a similar boat, but maybe for different reasons. I am a Therapy owner, but am looking to get a Maz 18 just to try something different. I definitely don't need more very versatility than the Therapy. Seems I can get a great variety of sounds from the Therapy at whatever volume I want. How big is your boat? You might be able to get a ZLux in there and maybe a Ghia or two as well.
|
|
|
Post by Ed M. on Feb 23, 2016 11:08:45 GMT -7
I'm not sure I understand what the Therapy isn't giving you that your looking to the Maz Jr. for. If your running the Therapy turned down so much that you feel your not hitting the sweet spot then the Maz may fit the bill. I loved my Maz Jr. NR with single coils but not as much with humbuckers. YMMV. Wouldn't you think the MAZ would be too loud if the Therapy isn't hitting the sweet spot? Usually my thinking of sweet spot involves louder volume. The one plus on the MAZ would be available reverb but OP says NR would be preferred. I might think the drive tones would compress more with EL84 vs 6L6 and that might be more desirable. sweet spot meaning getting the tubes working and the amp "breathing" I think the Maz will get to that point at a lower volume than the Therapy. I think the Therapy really comes alive with the master and volume at about 1 o'clock which can be quit loud. I agree the drive tones do compress more with the EL84 its got a more open and knarly less refined sound......really starting to miss that amp right now ;-)
|
|
|
Post by southmusic70 on Feb 23, 2016 11:09:05 GMT -7
Great comments, gentlemen!
My assumption is that the Maz is as versatile as the Therapy. My thing is that I look for that point where both pre-amp AND power tube saturation occur, so, yes I can turn up the volume and turn down the master to where the sounds are sonically tolerable on the Therapy, but I'm not getting the pre and power tube thing going on; the question is: is that doable on tha Maz?
I hope I don't sound like a cork sniffer, because I'm not.
|
|
|
Post by Ed M. on Feb 23, 2016 11:15:37 GMT -7
If that's what your looking for pre-amp and power-amp saturation then I think the Maz NR would be a great choice.
|
|
|
Post by benttop (Steve) on Feb 23, 2016 11:16:22 GMT -7
Airbrake is your friend here. Not everyone's cup of tea, but if used correctly, you cannot tell it is there, and you can get the power tubes happening on either amp.
They are both spectacular amps, but they are definitely different.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2016 12:26:07 GMT -7
Both are very versatile amps. If you're used to big bottle amps, the Maz 18 may take some getting used to. It has a thinner, one dimensional, more compressed sound associated with EL84's. Not bad, just different.
I only have about an hour on my Therapy, but it is bigger, bolder, more open, more touch sensitive and I think more versatile than my Maz 18. Running the Therapy through the Z12 makes it a bit more manageable volume wise as opposed to the Eminence V128. I would never sell my Maz 18, but if I had to choose just one, I'd keep the Therapy. I think I'd stand behind that decision even after the honeymoon phase dies off. I mean, it can take 6L6's, 6V6's, EL34's, KT77's, etc. That, in and of itself, is reason alone to experiment with different DB speakers and an Airbrake.
|
|
|
Post by benttop (Steve) on Feb 23, 2016 12:41:43 GMT -7
Running the Therapy through the Z12 makes it a bit more manageable volume wise... ^^^^^ This! I had a very hard time playing my Maz Jr. in the basement through the Celestion Alnico Gold I had installed in the combo. Theoretically my Z-Lux has more power, yet with the new Z speaker, it is way easier to control in the basement. I've played my Therapy through that Z-Lux combo cab and it definitely helps manage the volume.
|
|
|
Post by John on Feb 23, 2016 13:01:37 GMT -7
it can take 6L6's, 6V6's, EL34's, KT77's, etc. Are you sure about this? I don't remember the Therapy having this feature. I checked the Z website. It does not mention this. I don't own a Therapy, probably will never own one (I'm a Remedy guy)...so there's probably been a lot of talk about this amp that I've never heard.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2016 13:56:14 GMT -7
it can take 6L6's, 6V6's, EL34's, KT77's, etc. Are you sure about this? I don't remember the Therapy having this feature. I checked the Z website. It does not mention this. I don't own a Therapy, probably will never own one (I'm a Remedy guy)...so there's probably been a lot of talk about this amp that I've never heard. Found it right here. This pretty much sold me on getting a Therapy. ztalk.proboards.com/thread/63664/octal-tubes-6v6-5881-el34?page=1&scrollTo=708403
|
|
|
Post by dreamlander on Feb 23, 2016 13:56:47 GMT -7
I am in a similar boat, but maybe for different reasons. I am a Therapy owner, but am looking to get a Maz 18 just to try something different. I definitely don't need more very versatility than the Therapy. Seems I can get a great variety of sounds from the Therapy at whatever volume I want. How big is your boat? You might be able to get a ZLux in there and maybe a Ghia or two as well. Big enough for a Therapy and Z28 at the moment. Looking to trade the Z28 for Maz 18 or EZG 50.
|
|
|
Post by simpleton on Feb 23, 2016 14:19:09 GMT -7
How big is your boat? You might be able to get a ZLux in there and maybe a Ghia or two as well. Big enough for a Therapy and Z28 at the moment. Looking to trade the Z28 for Maz 18 or EZG 50. I'd say MAZ or maybe Ghia...to get the EL84 thing going. The EZG would definitely be a sweet big clean tone though. Nice boat.
|
|
|
Post by southmusic70 on Feb 23, 2016 14:42:40 GMT -7
Interesting...
Just to let you guys know where I'm coming from, the Zs I have had, in order of acquisition, are Z28 (converted to a 1x10 combo with Gold), Rati v2 (sold), Route 66 (sold), KT45 (likely soon to go), Carmen Ghia Anni 10/50 and Therapy. Speakers are open back 1x10 with Eminence Ramrod, Mesa open back1x12 w/ c90, 2x12 open back with Vin30s.
So: I wonder what the Therapy would sound like if I put in 6V6 tubes (since I have the 6L6 thing covered with a BF Vibrolux Reverb), then A/B it with my Z28 and see what happens.
A little off my OP, but an interesting result.
Thanks!
|
|
|
Post by dreamlander on Feb 23, 2016 17:16:54 GMT -7
Interesting... Just to let you guys know where I'm coming from, the Zs I have had, in order of acquisition, are Z28 (converted to a 1x10 combo with Gold), Rati v2 (sold), Route 66 (sold), KT45 (likely soon to go), Carmen Ghia Anni 10/50 and Therapy. Speakers are open back 1x10 with Eminence Ramrod, Mesa open back1x12 w/ c90, 2x12 open back with Vin30s. So: I wonder what the Therapy would sound like if I put in 6V6 tubes (since I have the 6L6 thing covered with a BF Vibrolux Reverb), then A/B it with my Z28 and see what happens. A little off my OP, but an interesting result. Thanks! Well, I thought that sounded interesting as well. So I just did it. Z28 and Therapy into the radial headbone and an Avatar 112 with C gold. Played them both for a while through the spectrum of sounds as I have done a number of times. Then let them cool down a bit and put some Tung-sol 6V6gt into the Therapy. At the mid volume range, where I usually play, master at 2 and the vol at 10 it was a bit quieter than the Z28 as I had them matched before the tube swap and did not touch the dials. The bass got a little mushy sounding and the highs weren't as articulate. Maybe a product of more bass overall, but just not as sweet sounding. I then set the Z28 to the 3,3,3 position and matched the Therapy to a similar output. It actually sounded alot better at this stage of gain. Preferred the Z28, but I could get the Therapy to sound VERY similar. So I MUCH preferred the 6L6 for the mostly clean tone, but actually liked the high gain sound of the 6V6. Wouldn't say better, but it was nice. I give a slight edge to the Z28 for the high gain stuff anyway, but I never really use that much gain so it is up for trade/sale.
|
|
|
Post by iluvpunz on Feb 23, 2016 17:35:50 GMT -7
Both are very versatile amps. If you're used to big bottle amps, the Maz 18 may take some getting used to. It has a thinner, one dimensional, more compressed sound associated with EL84's. Not bad, just different. I only have about an hour on my Therapy, but it is bigger, bolder, more open, more touch sensitive and I think more versatile than my Maz 18. Running the Therapy through the Z12 makes it a bit more manageable volume wise as opposed to the Eminence V128. I would never sell my Maz 18, but if I had to choose just one, I'd keep the Therapy. I think I'd stand behind that decision even after the honeymoon phase dies off. I mean, it can take 6L6's, 6V6's, EL34's, KT77's, etc. That, in and of itself, is reason alone to experiment with different DB speakers and an Airbrake. I've had both and gigged with both. This is right on for a comparison. The Jr is Voxy with some Marshall in there, pretty focused sound. Great but totally different from what you get with the Therapy. The Therapy is more Fender, bigger and I agree more versatile. The master on the Therapy is much better than the Maz Jr. It really depends on what you are trying to get out of the amp. The Jr is great at grindy biting tone but cleans are sometimes a bit thinner. The Therapy takes most pedals a little better than the Maz Jr. There is also a significant difference between the Maz reverb and non reverb models. The non reverb seems to break up sooner. The Jr's run the power tubes pretty hot so I ended up re-tubing about once a year. I wouldn't say there is a huge volume difference between the Maz Jr and the Therapy although the Therapy sounds much bigger. As Steve said speaker choice makes a big difference in volume with both amps. Therapy with a 1-12 Creamback may be lower overall volume than a Maz Jr with a Celestion Gold.
|
|
|
Post by southmusic70 on Feb 23, 2016 18:16:02 GMT -7
Good experiment, dreamlander
Thanks for the report
|
|
|
Post by ss "Shane" on Feb 24, 2016 12:37:57 GMT -7
Here is my experience having owned a Maz and still own a Therapy. First off let me say that my Maz 18 was the reverb.
Maz - Extremely loud! Still can't believe it was 18 watts and knowing what I know now I would have got the Maz 8. I had a hard time, too hard of a time, using it in my small music room. I tried to work the master and all that good stuff but the floor noise was too much for me. I really did like my Maz but to be honest, only at band levels. This is not my case, but I've read that the Maz 18 likes to eat tubes. This I wouldn't know since I only had the thing for 2 months before I bought my Therapy.
I sold the Maz in mint condition with no problems to find a more manageable amp. Also, I grew up on big bottles and I couldn't connect due to my Tele having a mini Humbucker in the neck. Some may say that I didn't spend enough time with settings but trust me, I did. I know within 5 minutes on a new amp if it's for me or not. Now here is what I miss about the Maz, the magic that happened when cranked. I get some awesome mojo magic with my Therapy but man, that Maz was wonderful.
w
Therapy - a very cool and manageable 35-40 watts. Very pleasing and so very easy to use in my music room and in public settings. This thing is almost dead silent with beautiful tones at low levels. Yes I understand how it "gets better" to some folks when the master is past 1 o'clock, but to me it just changes character which is not necessarily "better". The tone I get at low settings is nothing short of beautiful. The Therapy is my lifetime, number one amp for sure and I knew in 5 minutes. Heck I'm still learning new tricks with it lol.
With all that being said, both amps are better than anything I've ever owned, and thats mainly Fender's most popular makes.
Next purchase....Ghia. It just sounds like a fun amp to me.
|
|
|
Post by southmusic70 on Feb 24, 2016 12:51:21 GMT -7
I completely agree that the Therapy has beautiful tones at low volume. In fact, I'm taking it out with an archtop for a big band concert next week, a relatively quiet playing situation. The amp sounds good with any of my guitars, though, and it may at some point replace my Z28 as, with its EQ capabilities, it has arguably greater versatility.
|
|