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Post by walt on Aug 17, 2015 18:52:50 GMT -7
I am having a problem keeping several tracks from blurring together.Granted,I am using inexpensive equipt,and have limited experience,but I feel I should be able to listen for and find each element in a recording when it's done.I am interested in creating a much wider dynamic range.I have tried eq-ing across a wide range-bass is all bottom,cymbals are all high,and it helps some,but I am getting too much mid range blur.I am considering moving to acoustic gtr only for rhythm. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2015 19:36:59 GMT -7
Specific instrumentation? Sample?
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Post by Pete aka shouldb on Aug 17, 2015 22:50:42 GMT -7
I am no recorder / producer, but Joe Walsh always advocated, when layering guitars, start with an acoustic or two and work your way up the gain levels......... only way to maintain depth and breadth
Just FYI
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Post by walt on Aug 18, 2015 5:11:53 GMT -7
It's usually 4-6 tracks of drums,bass,guitars-sometimes 4-5 tracks,but not all doing the same thing.occasionally organ,and then 1/2 tracks "singing" This is an attempt at what the Ramones version of Hungry Heart would have sounded like.Not really the best example since their sound was a wall of rhythm guitars.It's 6 tracks drums,bass,2 rhythm guitars,a clean guitar from the middle eight on,2 vocs,and a purposefully faint backing voc. themudlegboots.bandcamp.com/track/hungry-heart-ramones-version
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2015 6:47:03 GMT -7
What's your setup? (Daw, self contained recorder, separates). Do you have any compression? Do you have a good handle on how to use it/what it does?
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Post by walt on Aug 18, 2015 7:09:25 GMT -7
I use a DAW called Reaper-I have a basic understanding of compression,but haven't had the time to learn the DAW software more than the basics.I am trying to do too much in too little time with music-playing better,recording,learning new things-as I usually do in my life.Also my laptop starts to freeze with too many tracks/effects,so I try to keep it to a minimum.I need to upgrade my Computor/DAW before the end of the year.
the stuff I have online is covers I bang out just for fun,on my own stuff I take much longer,and want it to sound better thsn the covers.I find on test mixes though,I am winding up with similar results as the cover stuff.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2015 8:11:28 GMT -7
Compression is an absolute key part of recording and mixing. You need a good handle on it to do a good job at either. I'd suggest messing w a software comp to get yourself up to speed. Try it on vocal, try it on bass, try it on SN & OHs. I posted some good links in the recording section that can help explain.
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Post by walt on Aug 18, 2015 19:23:09 GMT -7
Thanks for the Tips.I'm gonna have to find some time to work on that.This song is musically and sonically what I am going for with my own stuff.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2015 18:21:30 GMT -7
Take some time to learn about EQ settings for everything you're throwing a mic on. The key to having things sit in the mix right is to have them eq'd so they are in their own space.
For example: when I mix electric guitar I always cut a good portion of lows and highs and boost mids. When the track is solo'd it doesn't sound all that good... BUT in the mix it sits great. It leaves room for kick and bass guitar on the low end, and cymbals and vocals on the high end.
Compression is great but it can kill the vibe of a song if it's used improperly (generally by adding too much). There are so many tips and tricks out there. Do some research and you can learn a lot really quick.
Learn about side chain compression, learn about mix buss compression, learn about what compression plugins are modeled after what hardware.... And what specific models work best with.
It may seem confusing but there are enough YouTube videos to learn a whole lot of useful information rather quickly.
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Post by walt on Aug 24, 2015 19:29:36 GMT -7
Thanks for the information.I just need to make the time.Seems like I am always running to catch up.
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Post by GuitarZ on Sept 3, 2015 13:02:28 GMT -7
Don't forget to use left/right separation. You can even move the bass a little right or left to get some space between kick and bass. In terms of EQ, I would just use Google to find EQ tips for separating guitars, bass/kick, vocals, etc and would always come up with some good tips. The other trick I found was using side chain compression. If the piano or guitar was sitting close to the middle and pushing the vocals, I would use the vocal to trigger the compression to just take them down a little during the vocal lines.
The last tip is the hardest in my eyes. I've noticed that the good bands really have a knack of layering in what they're playing to not jump on top of each other. It's easier if you're doing guitar licks to practice pausing or taking them down during vocal lines. But, I'm really amazed how they'll weave guitar parts and keyboard parts together in such a way that it sounds like the engineer almost doesn't have to do anything to allow you to hear everything.
Keep experimenting, kicking out product, and getting better.
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Post by j4gitr (John) on Sept 3, 2015 15:23:40 GMT -7
I'm no expert, but I use the adage a little goes a long way. A little left a little right. It's been a while, but I even try the illusion of front to back to make things stand out w/ a little reverb/delay.
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Post by walt on Sept 3, 2015 15:59:58 GMT -7
Thanks for the input.Lately I have been doing some reading on compression.I'm working on a lot of subtle things-making chord shapes cleaner,cleaner backing guitars,etc.Here's what I think is a perfect mix-several guitars,bass, drums,organ,tubular bells,multi tracked vocs- all easily located in the mix.
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Post by j4gitr (John) on Sept 3, 2015 18:23:19 GMT -7
This is one of my favorite recording engineers. Don Was. A lot going on in this song but you hear everything crystal clear in many different places. It's all over the soundstage.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2015 18:23:49 GMT -7
Great arrangement too on that Bram T song. Room for all of it.
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Post by walt on Sept 3, 2015 19:11:06 GMT -7
Great arrangement too on that Bram T song. Room for all of it. Obviously another factor to consider when recording/mixing-If I want space,I need to leave room for it.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2015 20:12:35 GMT -7
Great arrangement too on that Bram T song. Room for all of it. Obviously another factor to consider when recording/mixing-If I want space,I need to leave room for it. Bigger than all the tech stuff for sure.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2015 10:40:59 GMT -7
^^ Lily's - "Cambridge California"
A song off of one of my favorite sounding records. It's warm sounding and spacious. They use left and right separation to introduce new instruments and background vocals. The guitar tones are interesting and present and the vocals sit so nicely. It's amazing how great tape recordings can be!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2015 10:46:41 GMT -7
This production just blew me away. Amazing separation while still gritty and raw.
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Post by GuitarZ on Sept 4, 2015 13:01:47 GMT -7
I think the Hellacopters aren't too far off from what I've been trying to do. They have nice separation on the guitars, but the guitars play off of each other better than what we accomplish in our band. All of the examples provide good references and good ideas.
I'll offer one more example of good mixing where you can hear the whole band in the mix. I was listening to James Hunter's "The Hard Way" CD for probably about year before it hit me that it was actually in mono. Now that is some producing and mixing to get a band with horns, keys, and guitar to come together without left/right separation. The tune below is off his last CD which was also mono.
And, this reminds me of another good tip to hit the 'mono' button while mixing to see how it's all playing together before going back to stereo.
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