mattp
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by mattp on Mar 14, 2015 19:24:05 GMT -7
Hey Everyone, Just curious--I own a Z Wreck combo, and lately I've been running it with the volume at 1:00, Bass at 2:00, Treble around 11:30, Cut at 12:00, in Comfort mode, Brake Lite at 2 clicks and I'm struggling to keep up with an 18W head/cab in my band. On it's own, this setting is LOUD, but in the band it sits well. Are these settings loud to other users? Iwe are a loud band, and I was expecting this amp to really be louder at this volume. It sounds EXACTLY as I want, but curious if it's the combo vs head/cab issue, or I'm just trippin'...should I take the attenuation out? Or just keep turning it up? Ha. Anyway...any insight would be cool. Matt
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Post by telejas on Mar 14, 2015 22:02:17 GMT -7
Take the Brake-Lite out of the signal (put on "0" clicks) and see if you can keep up? That's where I'd start.
I just got home from a gig using my 1x12 combo. Volume on about 10:00, bass, treble and cut all about noon with my Brake-Lite 2 clicks down and I had no problems keeping up.
I think it all has to do with stage volume (or practice volume) and what you're used to. The Z-Wreck does have less clean head room than some other 30w + Z amps, but it should still keep up if you mess with the Brake Lite.
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Post by jlowder23 on Mar 14, 2015 23:42:01 GMT -7
Man, yall must be really loud. The most I've ever got out of mine is brake lite on 3 clicks and volume around 10. At that setting, it's still usually a bit loud. I use my m12 the majority of the time, on the low setting, with the volume at 1.
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Post by muZician on Mar 15, 2015 2:59:04 GMT -7
I play my ZWreck through the Airbrake at 3 or 4 clicks and at 1:00 to 3:00 volume it is still freaking loud. I am thinking of buying a plexyglass shield...
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Post by doctorice on Mar 15, 2015 6:05:35 GMT -7
Yeah, that would be pretty loud in my book.
Are you having a straightforward issue with simply being too low in the mix? Less attenuation would be the likely solution. Or are you having trouble cutting through on some parts or on leads? Your B and T settings are such that the mids are probably recessed, depending on guitar and pedals used. You may just need more mids when playing with the band. Sometimes what sounds great when playing alone is not right for the band mix.
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mattp
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by mattp on Mar 15, 2015 7:51:36 GMT -7
Ya, I think I'm wrong. I went back and listened to some recording and watched some of our live videos--the Wreck cuts like a knife in our mix. It has to be our practice space--two large subs, loud bass player, and the other guitarists rig faces directly at me. I can only wonder what he's getting from me! Ha! Thanks guys--great insight. Yes, we are loud...
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Post by jlowder23 on Mar 15, 2015 8:00:33 GMT -7
Do you set your amp on the ground? If so, you might try tilting it back so it's pointed more at your head. I usually use my road case as an amp stand. It works really great.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2015 8:04:15 GMT -7
Carpet on the floor? That always ruins the fun for me.
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Post by telejas on Mar 15, 2015 9:57:00 GMT -7
I play my ZWreck through the Airbrake at 3 or 4 clicks and at 1:00 to 3:00 volume it is still freaking loud. I am thinking of buying a plexyglass shield... Like this It works great and sound men LOVE it!
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mattp
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by mattp on Mar 15, 2015 10:43:57 GMT -7
That plexi shield--where did you get the plexiglass? I have something similar, but I think the plexiglass is too thin, or it's not for sound.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2015 10:45:29 GMT -7
Whenever I see one of those plexiglass things my ocd kicks in and I'm running for the windex.
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Post by telejas on Mar 15, 2015 12:36:01 GMT -7
That plexi shield--where did you get the plexiglass? I have something similar, but I think the plexiglass is too thin, or it's not for sound. I just got a sheet of plexi-glass at the local hardware store, cut it into 3 equal parts and bought $10 in hinges and screws/nuts. After a few gigs, some of the nuts were getting loose so I got some lock-washers and put a dab of super glue on each nut after I tightened them down. I have heard of people having some "out of phase" issues, but that's with the shield sitting too close and bouncing the sound back into the mic - I haven't had any issues with that. As for the Windex comment.... Yeah, it does get scratched up (and dirty) pretty easy. But you really can't tell from the front of the stage, so I've learned to control my OCD in that regard.
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Post by Paul (TRANE) on Mar 15, 2015 13:05:24 GMT -7
I used to play a place that was acoustically dead as a doornail. I could bring a head and my 4x12 and crank it up and no complaints from anyone. Of course nothing seemed loud in there but you could still deafen a wharf rat at 100 paces.
Sent from my SM-N900V using proboards
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2015 12:19:33 GMT -7
That plexi shield--where did you get the plexiglass? I have something similar, but I think the plexiglass is too thin, or it's not for sound. Google the word Clearsonic. You can find the stuff directly through Clearsonic or Sweetwater Music etc. It comes in different sizes www.clearsonic.com/ www.sweetwater.com/store/manufacturer/ClearSonic
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Post by thatstatuemoved on Apr 5, 2015 19:12:13 GMT -7
Do you set your amp on the ground? If so, you might try tilting it back so it's pointed more at your head. I usually use my road case as an amp stand. It works really great. This is great advice--I bought a stand for my amp that tilts it back and you cannot believe what a difference this makes--directs the sound up where you can hear it better. Try it, you will like it.
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Post by j4gitr (John) on Apr 6, 2015 4:08:22 GMT -7
Do you set your amp on the ground? If so, you might try tilting it back so it's pointed more at your head. I usually use my road case as an amp stand. It works really great. This is great advice--I bought a stand for my amp that tilts it back and you cannot believe what a difference this makes--directs the sound up where you can hear it better. Try it, you will like it. +1 This one is my choice. Folds up easy and nothing to carry. www.standback.net
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Post by telejas on Apr 6, 2015 7:30:11 GMT -7
Probably beating a dead horse here..... But be mindful of your volume, I know these are only 30w but that's still loud enough to cause permanent hearing damage. Every time I hear someone talk about leaning an amp back, I go back to a story my old bass player told me about 15 years ago. He said "I played lead guitar in the 70s/early 80s with two Fender Twins behind me, on 10, leaning back on their tilt-back legs...The louder the better"! I spoke to him last year, he now has hearing aids and said he can't hear hardly anything without them, he's only 55. He said he wishes he would have taken more care of his hearing back then. I know this ins't the same thing and it's only 30w, but I feel I should at least say something everytime I see a thread about aiming an amp at your head/ears. Now back to regular post.....
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Post by thatstatuemoved on Apr 6, 2015 8:43:51 GMT -7
Probably beating a dead horse here..... But be mindful of your volume, I know these are only 30w but that's still loud enough to cause permanent hearing damage. Every time I hear someone talk about leaning an amp back, I go back to a story my old bass player told me about 15 years ago. He said "I played lead guitar in the 70s/early 80s with two Fender Twins behind me, on 10, leaning back on their tilt-back legs...The louder the better"! I spoke to him last year, he now has hearing aids and said he can't hear hardly anything without them, he's only 55. He said he wishes he would have taken more care of his hearing back then. I know this ins't the same thing and it's only 30w, but I feel I should at least say something everytime I see a thread about aiming an amp at your head/ears. Now back to regular post..... Good advice here. My thinking on tilting my amp back is I am able to hear it better and therefore do not have to turn it up near as loud. It makes a big difference when tilted and I could not agree more with telejas to be mindful of your volume at all times.
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Post by jlowder23 on Apr 6, 2015 10:40:07 GMT -7
Probably beating a dead horse here..... But be mindful of your volume, I know these are only 30w but that's still loud enough to cause permanent hearing damage. Every time I hear someone talk about leaning an amp back, I go back to a story my old bass player told me about 15 years ago. He said "I played lead guitar in the 70s/early 80s with two Fender Twins behind me, on 10, leaning back on their tilt-back legs...The louder the better"! I spoke to him last year, he now has hearing aids and said he can't hear hardly anything without them, he's only 55. He said he wishes he would have taken more care of his hearing back then. I know this ins't the same thing and it's only 30w, but I feel I should at least say something everytime I see a thread about aiming an amp at your head/ears. Now back to regular post..... Good advice here. My thinking on tilting my amp back is I am able to hear it better and therefore do not have to turn it up near as loud. It makes a big difference when tilted and I could not agree more with telejas to be mindful of your volume at all times. That's exactly what I do. My volume is very low because it's tilted upward. When I had my wreck combo, I ran 3 clicks on the BL and volume at 9.
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Post by deltone on Apr 6, 2015 12:13:57 GMT -7
We mic everything out to the mains and use in-ear monitors so we have a very low stage volume. Even so, I tilt my cabinet up towards my ears. It adds a depth that makes hearing my guitar so much more fuller than the thinner sound that I got in my ears prior to tilting the cab upward. And it makes the FOH mix so much better as it pretty much eliminates the fight between the amp and the mains. Fwiw, we use a decibel meter at every gig to set our overall volume and rarely, if ever, exceed 85-90 dbs at the furthest point on the dance floor. We're probably the quietest band in town, and the older folks love us. Rare is the comment that we're too loud.
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Post by sanders4617 on Apr 6, 2015 12:31:42 GMT -7
Tilting this amp makes a huge difference. My first gig I left it on the ground and ran the amp at 10 with no attenuation. Second time I tilted it and ran the attenuator on 1 or 2. Can't remember. But it made a big difference. I was prob a lot louder than I realized the first night. Lol. For me, I normally don't like pointing the amp directly at my ears though.
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Post by doctorice on Apr 7, 2015 4:43:09 GMT -7
One observation on tilting the amp back: It works well when you've got some space to spread out. I found that when we set up in a really tight space, which is often, the tilt back causes my amp to bleed into the vocal mics. No room for shields and no point in miking the amp since the venue is small. YMMV.
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Post by jesslm02 on Apr 7, 2015 5:11:23 GMT -7
One observation on tilting the amp back: It works well when you've got some space to spread out. I found that when we set up in a really tight space, which is often, the tilt back causes my amp to bleed into the vocal mics. No room for shields and no point in miking the amp since the venue is small. YMMV. That's exactly what I was about to say... tilting the amp in close quarters will have it aiming at your vocal mic, and yes it will make you louder in the mains and harder for the soundman to control. I had to pretty much stop tilting my amp for this reason. If I sang every song it might different.
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Post by doctorice on Apr 8, 2015 8:20:14 GMT -7
One observation on tilting the amp back: It works well when you've got some space to spread out. I found that when we set up in a really tight space, which is often, the tilt back causes my amp to bleed into the vocal mics. No room for shields and no point in miking the amp since the venue is small. YMMV. That's exactly what I was about to say... tilting the amp in close quarters will have it aiming at your vocal mic, and yes it will make you louder in the mains and harder for the soundman to control. I had to pretty much stop tilting my amp for this reason. If I sang every song it might different. Great minds....
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2015 4:53:12 GMT -7
That's exactly what I was about to say... tilting the amp in close quarters will have it aiming at your vocal mic, and yes it will make you louder in the mains and harder for the soundman to control. I had to pretty much stop tilting my amp for this reason. If I sang every song it might different. Great minds.... It'll also wreck the sound coming out of the monitors too.
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Post by doctorice on Apr 9, 2015 5:12:30 GMT -7
Fwiw:
Most of my gigs do not involve feeding all instruments through the board and having a sound person controlling the mix. They're basic bar/club gigs with only vocals going into the PA. As I mentioned I usually have to stand pretty close to my amp, so my ears are pretty far off the speaker's axis and, as a result, I don't really perceive the full volume or tone. My rule of thumb is that if I just barely hear my guitar when I'm not playing leads I'm probably at about the right volume in the ensemble mix. (It can still be a little tricky getting it right for both the audience and my bandmates.) When I have a lead, I let it rip pretty loud. This sometimes gets a comment from one of the singers. My riposte is "When I'm playing a solo, I believe I should be at about the same volume in the mix as you are when you're singing lead vocal. And since I'm not in the PA, I need to generate that volume at the source, so yes, I'm going to be loud in the stage mix at that point. But I bring it back down when my solo ends."
I'd love to hear more tips, comments, etc. related to the thread topic.
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Post by jesslm02 on Apr 9, 2015 6:34:07 GMT -7
We run everything through the PA - no matter the room size. So we keep a pretty low stage volume. And use IEMs. Maybe overkill for the smaller rooms but it's what we are setup for and it works good for us. Even with that, I still have to step on a boost to make a solo stand out from the band mix. I still don't like the sound of my amp coming through the IEMs, and that usually results in me pulling one side out. Which can lead to other issues...
But as for monitoring purposes, if I can't hear my amp, it's just a knob turn away as we use the behringer personal monitor system and x32 rackmount. Great system by the way.
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