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Post by tonechaser on Jan 19, 2015 22:36:00 GMT -7
I've had the M -12 for almost 2 years now, and I'm ready for a speaker change. It has the greenback now.
Let me first say that I don't know squat about speakers. Brands, styles, magnets, etc. I just know the greenback had a little more mid - push than I prefer. I play classic country, new country, and classic rock, and like highs and lows with scooped mids.
Could someone suggest a speaker for the M -12 that fits that description? I've been doing a lot of research, but there's so many brands and so many speakers I'm getting dizzy. I was looking at the Jensen tornado and the celestion blue.
Any suggestions would help, thanks
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Post by muZician on Jan 19, 2015 23:12:54 GMT -7
Celestion Gold is the one to go
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Post by simpleton on Jan 19, 2015 23:42:11 GMT -7
Do you like the loudness of the Greenback or would you like a little more volume out of the speaker?
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Jan 20, 2015 9:13:40 GMT -7
The landscape of guitar speakers can be vast and bewildering. (Much like the world of tubes.) There's a lot of mis-information, speaker names that sound or look like each other but the speakers are very different (even within the same brand!), and opinions can vary wildly (one man's "dark" is another man's "warm" or even "dull"). Plus everyone's ears are different. Sad to say, you really need to hear things yourself to make a judgement.
That being said, the Greenback (aka. Celestion's G12M model... which has spawned coutless imitators, many of which are quite good, actually) is right at home with the M12. With all my speaker-swapping & adjectives, I can't quite describe it--something about it just "fits" nicely. The G12 Blue also works nicely, but is more expenseive and a little on the brighter side.
Generally, when you start swapping speakers, it's in an effort to get more/less of a certain part of the amp's sound... like "I want more highs" or "I want tighter bass" or "louder." Is there some way you're looking to shape the M12's sound? What volume levels are you working with?
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Post by tonechaser on Jan 20, 2015 10:18:22 GMT -7
Volume is usually between noon and 1 on the high setting. But, I have a few pedals with volume or "level" settings, which I try to set neutral (same volume level with the pedal off and on)
That being said, I'd like a speaker with a little bit looser bottom end than the greenback, (not sloppy loose), more of a mid scoop than the greenback, and maybe a tad more highs.
I'm still researching all this and learning as I go, so be patient. I'm one of those guys who's been playing for 30 years, knows what sounds good and what doesn't, but never got into the "gear" side or the "why" it sounds good aspects of it.
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Jan 20, 2015 10:51:37 GMT -7
I'm still researching all this and learning as I go, so be patient. I'm one of those guys who's been playing for 30 years, knows what sounds good and what doesn't... Knowing what you like & don't like is all the skills you need, man. In fact, some speakers I've tried it was just like I played the first chord and said, "Nope." (After first cranking some chords on a looper and letting it "break in" for a while, that is.) Celestion's G12H-30 Anniversary is sort of the bigger brother to the Greenback speaker that you have now. But it's got a bigger magnet--so it's heavier--and also has more LO & HI end, and sounds more "scooped" in the mids. It's also noticeably louder, too. Plus you can get 'em fairly inexpensively at places like Avatar Speakers, or elsewhere. Might be a good place to start--although, fair warning, there's not a lot of chatter around here where people love that amp & speaker combination. (Everyone hears things differently, though.) Also, here are some YouTube videos that I've always liked for speaker comparison, as they lets you listen to one directly after the other--really bringing out the differences. 15 speakers compared by Rivera: Pete Thorn demos some G12M, G12H, and G12M-65 clones:...if you hear something that you really like (especially in the Scumback vid) I can help you figure out what all those number/letter codes mean, etc.
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Post by bloozeman on Jan 21, 2015 10:43:55 GMT -7
Im digging the tone of the M75. wonder how these would be for Blues/Rock in the style of hendrix, SRV, Kenny Wayne Shepherd etc?
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Jan 21, 2015 12:25:59 GMT -7
^ The H75 might actually be better for those styles (louder/tighter spank on the low-end, and more predominant highs); however I could never say that the M75 doesn't sound fantastic all-around, either.
Or.. you could split the difference with the J75. That's what I did in my 1x12 (little bit o' "M" sound, little bit o' "H" sound, as if you'd mixed an M & H in one cab).
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Post by bloozeman on Jan 21, 2015 15:45:55 GMT -7
Thanks for the info Mark. I'm definitely going to look into these further
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Post by bloozeman on Jan 21, 2015 16:42:28 GMT -7
^ The H75 might actually be better for those styles (louder/tighter spank on the low-end, and more predominant highs); however I could never say that the M75 doesn't sound fantastic all-around, either. Or.. you could split the difference with the J75. That's what I did in my 1x12 (little bit o' "M" sound, little bit o' "H" sound, as if you'd mixed an M & H in one cab). Mark what are the differences between the M and J and H speakers? What do the letters mean? Something to do with being a ceramic or alnico or magnet size?
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Jan 21, 2015 19:49:49 GMT -7
Mark what are the differences between the M and J and H speakers? What do the letters mean? Something to do with being a ceramic or alnico or magnet size? Almost all Scumback's are ceramic magnet, actually. (Only the ones called Scum nico are AlNiCo.) M, J, and H refer to the magnet sizes--35 oz., 40 oz., and 50 oz., respectively. The numbers "75" and "55" refer to the resonant frequency of each cone--75 being the "lead/guitar" cone, and 55 being the "bass" cone. [Remember Celestion's oft-misunderstood G12H(75) and G12H(55) speakers? Same thing--in Scumback speak, those would be the H75 and H55.] Jim's got a bit of a "cheat sheet" here on his website; this mostly explains which specific real vintage Celestions correlate to his current products. But he's got more than are explained on that page, even (like the J- series). His FAQ section here might even explain some more. ...See what I mean about "the landscape of guitar speakers" being "vast and bewildering"? Anybody confused yet?? Heck, Celestion themselves have like 7 speakers on the market right now all bearing the letters "G12H" or "G12M." It's no wonder we're all confused...
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Post by bloozeman on Jan 22, 2015 12:13:33 GMT -7
what are your thoughts on the scumback H55 Mark? Might be a great speaker for blues tones? a little fatter and thicker than the H75?
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Jan 22, 2015 14:04:34 GMT -7
^Yup, would likely work well. Just don't over-do it with like 4 of those H55's in one cabinet.. it starts to become a little "too much" at that point.
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Post by bloozeman on Jan 22, 2015 15:14:42 GMT -7
^Yup, would likely work well. Just don't over-do it with like 4 of those H55's in one cabinet.. it starts to become a little "too much" at that point. How about 2 in a 2x12? Or would You mix an h55 with an h75 in that scenario? If it were you
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Post by Mark (Basement Enthusiast) on Jan 22, 2015 20:02:32 GMT -7
Personally, I'd mix the H55 & H75.. unless it was a pretty shallow open-back cabinet like a Fender Twin or something like that. But if the cabinet's got any girth on its own, then the 2 H-speakers will be pretty good on their own, with one 55 Hz likely being enough extra "oomph."
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Post by mshartz on Jan 28, 2015 21:30:36 GMT -7
After having my M12 for about a month, I decided that I wanted a more punchy tone with less sag (more Stangray sounding). So first I swapped the rectifer tube with a 5AR4, that made quite an improvement, but when I swapped out the Greenback for a Celestion Gold---WOW! Crystal clear highs and a tighter bottom that just gets better the more I play it.
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Post by smolder on Jan 28, 2015 22:02:17 GMT -7
I found a deal on a couple of Altec 417b's yesterday. The JBL K120 I was using was close... But needs to be pushed louder to balance out. Very bright at low volume... Theoretically, the Altec should fix that (same cone, alnico, and aluminum dust cap).
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